The Environment

@TG -- Steve Bannon is not exactly what I'd call a "policy wonk". He's a political strategist and he created Breitbart. He certainly has an agenda and significant influence in political decisions. There is however nothing to suggest he is a detailed academic when it comes to policy. The "wonk" part of this seems entirely the wrong term.

 
commando said:
dudeguyy said:
And in other words, Mike Pence still doesn't get what all the fuss is about...
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and the flat earthers in the republican party don't recognize the threat. f#*k this party...i am changing to democratic and voting based on candidates not having an R by their names. this party is f'ing retarded.
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Good for you.

There's an important discussion to be had about blind partisanship and just checking the box for a D or R without much thought.

At the same time, I'm just flat out not going to vote for someone as intellectually dishonest about a topic like climate change as Pence. I mean, he just lies to my face about it. I can't vote for someone that has such blatant disregard for my intelligence as that. Especially for something that I really care about.

At least if they told me they don't care or they want to focus on the economy no matter the cost they'd be being truthful.

 
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Trump knows all about global warming and its effects on the coasts.

Trump acknowledges climate change — at his golf course

Donald Trump says he is “not a big believer in global warming.” He has called it “a total hoax,” “bullsh#t” and “pseudoscience.”

But he is also trying to build a sea wall designed to protect one of his golf courses from “global warming and its effects.”

The New York billionaire is applying for permission to erect a coastal protection works to prevent erosion at his seaside golf resort, Trump International Golf Links & Hotel Ireland, in County Clare.

A permit application for the wall, filed by Trump International Golf Links Ireland and reviewed by POLITICO, explicitly cites global warming and its consequences — increased erosion due to rising sea levels and extreme weather this century — as a chief justification for building the structure.

Trump snatched up the golf resort from a distressed buyer in February 2014, after a winter in which an unusual number of severe storms hit the west coast of Ireland. The businessman immediately took an active hand in advancing and promoting his Irish investment.

Earlier this month, after failing to win special approval from the national government for the structure, Trump re-submitted a planning application with the Clare County Council seeking permission to build the wall, which would consist of 200,000 tons of rock distributed along two miles of beach. As part of the application, Trump International Golf Links submitted an environmental impact statement — prepared by an Irish environmental consultancy — which argues that erosion is likely to accelerate as sea levels rise more quickly.

The statement acknowledges one Irish government study that assumes a steady rate of erosion through 2050, but argues that the study fails to account for the effects of climate change: “If the predictions of an increase in sea level rise as a result of global warming prove correct, however, it is likely that there will be a corresponding increase in coastal erosion rates not just in Doughmore Bay but around much of the coastline of Ireland. In our view, it could reasonably be expected that the rate of sea level rise might become twice of that presently occurring. … As a result, we would expect the rate of dune recession to increase.”
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All this this high level talk is really cheap from all sides. My questions to everyone that is so outraged. How have you changed your habits within the last few years to reduce energy use and waste? Very few people in the US and most developed countries care to give up their luxuries and most people in undeveloped countries are just trying to survive from day to day to care too much about the overall environment. But hey, we can keep taking shots at political leaders for doing what they do best and we can keep on not being responsible for our waste. Just keep buying the next shinny thing and throwing the old stuff away.

 
jaws said:
All this this high level talk is really cheap from all sides. My questions to everyone that is so outraged. How have you changed your habits within the last few years to reduce energy use and waste? Very few people in the US and most developed countries care to give up their luxuries and most people in undeveloped countries are just trying to survive from day to day to care too much about the overall environment. But hey, we can keep taking shots at political leaders for doing what they do best and we can keep on not being responsible for our waste. Just keep buying the next shinny thing and throwing the old stuff away.
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I recycle, I conserve food, I have reduced my household waste every year. I have further insulated my house, updated my HVAC system and tinted the sun-facing windows on my house. I am in the process of painting my house with a lighter color to further reduce solar impact.

I grow a garden, I bike when I can, and take public transportation when it's realistic.

 
jaws said:
All this this high level talk is really cheap from all sides. My questions to everyone that is so outraged. How have you changed your habits within the last few years to reduce energy use and waste? Very few people in the US and most developed countries care to give up their luxuries and most people in undeveloped countries are just trying to survive from day to day to care too much about the overall environment. But hey, we can keep taking shots at political leaders for doing what they do best and we can keep on not being responsible for our waste. Just keep buying the next shinny thing and throwing the old stuff away.
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lol at you and your outrage at people who are shocked at what our so called president and his "party" are doing. just because you don't recycle stuff or try to find another use for an old item before throwing it in the trash doesn't mean all americans are not trying to do something. how many hybrid cars are out there? or solar panels? wind turbines? how many people people super insulate their homes to help conserve energy? americans are trying to clean things up but because we are not there yet doesn't mean we shouldn't try to do better. throwing our hands up and saying it's too tough so why even try approach will not help us.....well, at least many of us don't think it will help. But Donnie has an R by his name so many republicans will buy into that plan

 
My questions to everyone that is so outraged. How have you changed your habits within the last few years to reduce energy use and waste?
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Individuals do not have the capacity to move the needle. That’s precisely why this is and has always been a public policy discussion — which isn’t to say that what little efforts one can make to be green are not commendable.

That’s another thing about policy. It changes the world in a way that enables people to better make those choices — for example, by lowering the cost and increasing the quality of reduced energy devices. Your question is tantamount to saying, for example, “Why do you guys want to build recycling centers? In the current (hypothetical) absence of them, how many of you reuse all your stuff and turn your toilet paper into notebooks?”

But hey, we can keep taking shots at political leaders for doing what they do best
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Political leaders for whom “what they do best” is irresponsibly shirking global responsibilities when the time to act was yesterday deserve every criticism they get, and then some.

Flipping this conversation to redirect outrage at straw man individuals who don't have the power to make the big decisions, and away from those who do and insist on choosing the wrong ones, is a meritless and disreputable tactic. We've constructed this world of energy consumption and dependance and it will take massive communal effort to respond to the problems it has created for us.

 
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commando said:
jaws said:
All this this high level talk is really cheap from all sides. My questions to everyone that is so outraged. How have you changed your habits within the last few years to reduce energy use and waste? Very few people in the US and most developed countries care to give up their luxuries and most people in undeveloped countries are just trying to survive from day to day to care too much about the overall environment. But hey, we can keep taking shots at political leaders for doing what they do best and we can keep on not being responsible for our waste. Just keep buying the next shinny thing and throwing the old stuff away.
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lol at you and your outrage at people who are shocked at what our so called president and his "party" are doing. just because you don't recycle stuff or try to find another use for an old item before throwing it in the trash doesn't mean all americans are not trying to do something. how many hybrid cars are out there? or solar panels? wind turbines? how many people people super insulate their homes to help conserve energy? americans are trying to clean things up but because we are not there yet doesn't mean we shouldn't try to do better. throwing our hands up and saying it's too tough so why even try approach will not help us.....well, at least many of us don't think it will help. But Donnie has an R by his name so many republicans will buy into that plan
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Not really outrage on my part but I think more can be done at a personal level in the US. There are people that won't change their minds about pollution and waste because it gets dumped in someone else back yard but soon enough they will be out numbered. However, there are people that lean to the left politically that waste just as much as those that lean to the right. That is why this shouldn't be a political issue but just plain common decency. We need to consume less and take responsibility for our waste. That starts at a personal level. We can debate about climate change all day, but, we can't dismiss the fact that a bunch of trash is floating about in the ocean, pollution in the air, and trash on our land. We need to start cleaning it up and try to stop adding to the mess.

 
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