What did we learn? Mich St version

ColoradoHusk said:
The argument could be made that Satt was too pass happy, but a lot of “experts” thought the best way to attack Michigan State was passing.  The trouble with that is NU isn’t good enough passing to take advantage of that.
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Agree.  MSU's pass defense was statistically their weakness.

But as you state, HH isn't a good enough passer to take advantage of that (and our OL might not be up to handling it either).  Calling that many 1st down passes with HH is just asking for trouble IMO.  We're just setting ourselves up to be behind the sticks.

ColoradoHusk said:
NU did come out running the ball well in the 2nd half, but stopped itself after Bullock dropped a pass which would have gained an important first down. MSU then went ahead by three the next drive, and NU struggled to move the ball in the 3rd quarter and early 4th, especially running the ball. 
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In the 3Q, we just didn't run that many plays - 10 total.  We did rip off back to back 11 yard runs on the 1st possession, but ended up punting off the Bullock drop.  Then back to back to back 3 and outs ending the 3Q and beginning the 4Q - 6 passes (3 sacks, 1 completion) / 3 rushes.

 
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Oh, another thing: we've actually seen several plays this year where we went empty backfield with 4-5 guys wide. I remember @brophog saying to watch for that but I was skeptical we'd see it at all.

It would be really nice to see some quick hitter passes out of that formation because we just don't pass block all that well and Haarberg tends to not remain calm even when we do. Have to just get the ball out of his hand quick.

 
gossamorharpy said:
HH been getting piled on a lot, and deservedly so for the most part. But the bolded above was such a key event to work against us. I believe that was the 2nd ball that bullock should’ve caught for a first down and dropped it. We don’t have an all conf qb and you gotta make basic/routine plays as a wide out to lift him up and keep a drive going. 
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Undone said:
Yep. One of the biggest plays of the game. Ugh.
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Bullock also had a 3rd down drop against Colorado on our first drive after scoring, when it was still a game. We just don't have anyone you can really trust in the passing game - blocking, throwing, or catching.

 
Red Five said:
We threw the ball 15 times in the 1st half (plus probably a handful of other attempts not showing up due to sacks/scrambles).  We threw the ball 11 times all game vs Purdue and 17 times all game vs Northwestern.

Here are the down and distances of those pass plays up to our last drive of the 1st half which was affected by time left in the half and penalties. 

2nd and 4 for -3 yards

3rd and 7 incomplete

1st and 10 for 5 yards

1st and 10 incomplete

1st and 10 sack

2nd and 15 for -4 yards

3rd and 19 interception

3rd and 4 for 27 yards

1st and 10 incomplete

1st and 10 for 22 yards

1st and 10 incomplete

3rd and 11 incomplete

We tried to throw 12 passes, with 6 of those on 1st downs (out of 11 1st and 10s) and 3 on 3rd and longs.  2 of those 3rd and longs were caused by losing yards on 2nd down passes and one due to an incomplete 1st down pass.
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I wanted to go back and look at this but haven't gotten around to it yet.

But it seemed to me like we were fairly predictable in what we were doing.  It seems like our first couple of plays on a possession were runs, until we got a first down.  Then we'd throw on the second first down of the possession, often with limited success.  Then we'd try to run on second and long and didn't get much.  Then we'd try to throw again on third and long, often with limited success.

 
Fru said:
We haven’t been to a bowl in 6 years. So freaking what if HH’s best win is NW? 
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I mean, I stated that it’s not his fault our schedule is against some of the worst P5 teams and he’s won most of them. He played against one dominant team and looked awful, granted, Michigan has done that to basically every QB they’ve faced. 

Discounting the direct W/L in games HH has played, his opponents are a combined 27-30. He currently has the 104th best QBR… so stating his best win is NW has some merit to how I would interpret program progress and success. Mike Riley once had a #7 AP team, but most fans knew that was a direct result of the schedule order than actual team success. 

Let’s hope Nebraska wins on Saturday to break that bowl drought! 

 
ColoradoHusk said:
Very fair points, and I agree with you for the most part.  Satt did try a G-belly option pass which worked great for 2 big plays the previous 2 weeks, and it didn’t work against Michigan Statw. I honestly don’t know if we are good enough running the ball to do “only that”. 
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To me, the best scenario is if we pass maybe 10-15 times a game.  Get as creative as we can with the run game.  Have some success with that and surprise them with a pass every once in a while.  If we get behind, like we did this week, that number of passes would probably inch up.

 
BigRedBuster said:
To me, the best scenario is if we pass maybe 10-15 times a game.  Get as creative as we can with the run game.  Have some success with that and surprise them with a pass every once in a while.  If we get behind, like we did this week, that number of passes would probably inch up.
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I think that's probably low.  We are currently #130 in the country in pass attempts for the year.  The only teams below us are Army, Navy and Air Force.  Air Force is the only team in the country averaging fewer than 15.  We're averaging 21 pass attempts per game. 

If you're not a threat to throw the ball, there will be less room to run because the safeties crowd the line.

 
Mavric said:
I think that's probably low.  We are currently #130 in the country in pass attempts for the year.  The only teams below us are Army, Navy and Air Force.  Air Force is the only team in the country averaging fewer than 15.
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I'm responding to this just for fun discussion, not because I'm really disagreeing with anything you're saying.

I do agree that "10-15 pass attempts per game is probably low." One thing though about "pass attempts per game" is that we're bleeding the play clock way down almost all the time, and we're first or close to first among Power 5 teams with the highest run/pass ratio (which is obviously a big part of this very discussion).

So, we're probably not running that many plays each game, period. I think looking at run/pass ratio is the biggest thing. And we've talked about how coming into the MSU game I think we were highest in Power 5.

I think we'd do better to just run more outside screens or quick slants. That might be where we find a happy medium between running more pass plays to pull the secondary back/out and also limiting doing things that aren't our strengths, maybe?

 
Undone said:
I'm responding to this just for fun discussion, not because I'm really disagreeing with anything you're saying.

I do agree that "10-15 pass attempts per game is probably low." One thing though about "pass attempts per game" is that we're bleeding the play clock way down almost all the time, and we're first or close to first among Power 5 teams with the highest run/pass ratio (which is obviously a big part of this very discussion).

So, we're probably not running that many plays each game, period. I think looking at run/pass ratio is the biggest thing. And we've talked about how coming into the MSU game I think we were highest in Power 5.

I think we'd do better to just run more outside screens or quick slants. That might be where we find a happy medium between running more pass plays to pull the secondary back/out and also limiting doing things that aren't our strengths, maybe?
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That's a fair point.  We are #122 in plays run, so that lowers the numbers.  

 
Mavric said:
** snip **  We are currently #130 in the country in pass attempts for the year.  The only teams below us are Army, Navy and Air Force.  ** snip **
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and.. Run The Damn BAll Guy still aint happy !!!

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