The Religious Discussion of 2012

[HuskerShark]

He is not close minded but rather confident in his faith. He isn't brushing anyone under the rug but rather trying to convince them that they are making a big mistake in not taking Jesus as their Lord and Savior. You can criticize his methods but you shouldn't insult his intellect with statements like close minded, that is not right. And I am sure if he is a Christian he doesn't feel anyone is a speck of dust, if anything he holds them dearly and wants them to have eternal life. Husker shark- Good job & Happy Ash Wednesday and keep the faith!!! I will be getting my cross tonight to show my faith, I hope everyone has a great day!! :thumbs

What?

How is not close-mindedness? By it's very definition it means someone who is intolerant of another's beliefs, or refuses to view something in another way. You read what he has said and say it isn't close-mindedness?

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that confidence in faith allows you to be ignorant and arrogant towards other people's beliefs, too? That's what HuskerShark has been doing this entire thread. Supporting that kind of behavior is supporting close-mindedness.

If my devout Catholic girlfriend can accept other people's faths/beliefs/religion, and Shark can't, I think that's saying something profound. He has the exact kind of behavior which instigated hundreds of years of religious wars and persecutions in the name of God.

Again, I have nothing to add to this already spot-on point. Kudos, Enhance.

I don't know where this is coming from. 3 or 4 of my friends are Jewish. A foreign exchange student from Norway that my parents had 2 or 3 years ago didn't believe in God. The other exchange student was from Taiwan and was not Christian either. You guys don't even know me, so don't be so quick to pass judgment.

 

[Enhance]

Again, I have nothing to add to this already spot-on point. Kudos, Enhance.

It's just getting ridiculous at this point, Mills. I don't see anybody here asking for proof, or even saying that people can't believe what they want. I've spent this entire thread trying to show the futility and utter arrogance in putting supreme confidence behind one's own beliefs. Yet, no matter what I say, they continue to provide "proof", necessitate their ability to provide proof and defend their narrow viewpoints because it's "faith."

I don't know how many times I can say that people can believe whatever they want, just understand that they could be wrong and others have different view points.

 

[knapplc]

I have no problem if you have faith in something, and if it helps you make it through the day, thats good.

But when you begin forcing your beliefs down someones throat, then there's a problem.

Who is forcing anything? I'm on here giving evidence that Christianity is correct in its teachings and that the Bible, even though it has been tampered with over time and may not have 100% accurate translations, still has a lot of validity and truth. Take this for example:

Noah's Ark was found in the mountains in Turkey almost 13,000 feet up on Mount Ararat. The length matches the exact descriptions about how big the ark was, as well as where the Bible said that it came to rest. It is slightly distorted because an earthquake occurred a couple of decades ago and uncovered it.

This is what it looked like before the earthquake. Perfect in shape but almost completely covered by the earth. Scientific testing has showed that the structure is composed of decayed wood and metal rivets and fasteners, and carbon dating has estimated that it is about 4,800 years old.

I don't mean to be a nuisance, just trying to get my point across.

This isn't Noah's Ark. This has been debunked quite thoroughly, actually. You really should check this stuff before you post it.

 

[Enhance]

I don't know where this is coming from. 3 or 4 of my friends are Jewish. A foreign exchange student from Norway that my parents had 2 or 3 years ago didn't believe in God. The other exchange student was from Taiwan and was not Christian either. You guys don't even know me, so don't be so quick to pass judgment.

Seriously? I guess I'll help you out.

No other religion has had proof that they are right about their beliefs like Christianity. God sent his only son to Earth so that he could die for our sins. What does that tell you? You're ignorant to believe in anything else.

This, in conjunction with the myriad of other close-minded statements you have made, is the problem. I don't care if you have confidence in your faith, but you have yet to come out and say you could be wrong and that other people have similar claim to their beliefs. When you finally do that, I will leave you alone in this thread.

 

[Husker_x]

This isn't Noah's Ark. This has been debunked quite thoroughly, actually. You really should check this stuff before you post it.

Why bother 'checking' 'facts' when confirmation bias gives you such a warm, tingly feeling inside?

 

[knapplc]

Some more on this "discovery" of Noah's Ark:

While news of the find is making headlines around the world, there's one part of the story that Yeung is conspicuously silent about: He is only the latest in a long line of people who claim to have found Noah's Ark. In fact, there have been at least half a dozen others — all of them funded by Christian organizations — who have claimed final, definitive proof of Noah's Ark. So far none of the claims have proven true.Noah's Ark is routinely re-discovered, because there are many who fervently want it to be found. Biblical literalists — those who believe that proof of the Bible's events remains to be found — have spent their lives and fortunes trying to scientifically validate their religious beliefs.

There are several reasons why the new claims should be treated with skepticism. For example, Yeung refuses to disclose the location of the find and is instead keeping it a secret. This of course is inherently unscientific; for the claims to be proven, the evidence must be presented to other scientists for peer-review. Nor has the alleged 5,000-year-old wood been made available for independent testing.

LINK

Dr. Price, who is director of the Center for Judaic Studies at the conservative Liberty University in Lynchburg, Va., was the archaeologist on the Chinese-led team in 2008 when this alleged discovery was first made. He says he has “difficulties with a number of issues related to the evidence at hand.”
Price declined to elaborate. However, a leaked email from Price – which he confirms that he wrote – shows that he has reason to believe that a group of local Kurdish men trucked wood up to the mountain and staged an elaborate hoax for the Chinese team.

A group of Kurdish workers “are said to have planted large wood beams taken from an old structure in the Black Sea area (where the photos were originally taken) at the Mt. Ararat site. … During the summer of 2009 more wood was planted inside a cave at the site. The Chinese team went in the late summer of 2009 (I was there at the time and knew about the hoax) and was shown the cave with the wood and made their film,” Price writes in the email.

Price is a longtime searcher himself for the ark. As a member of Noah’s Ark Search LLC, he had gone on a number of expeditions to Mount Ararat.

Price was not the only member to withdraw from the Chinese-led team over questions about their purported finding.

LINK

 

[carlfense]

Still trying to prove religion with evidence I see. That's a fool's game.

Religion is about faith.

Science is about evidence.

. . . and never the twain shall meet.

 

[johnnyrodgers20]

He is not close minded but rather confident in his faith. He isn't brushing anyone under the rug but rather trying to convince them that they are making a big mistake in not taking Jesus as their Lord and Savior. You can criticize his methods but you shouldn't insult his intellect with statements like close minded, that is not right. And I am sure if he is a Christian he doesn't feel anyone is a speck of dust, if anything he holds them dearly and wants them to have eternal life. Husker shark- Good job & Happy Ash Wednesday and keep the faith!!! I will be getting my cross tonight to show my faith, I hope everyone has a great day!! :thumbs

What?

How is not close-mindedness? By it's very definition it means someone who is intolerant of another's beliefs, or refuses to view something in another way. You read what he has said and say it isn't close-mindedness?

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that confidence in faith allows you to be ignorant and arrogant towards other people's beliefs, too? That's what HuskerShark has been doing this entire thread. Supporting that kind of behavior is supporting close-mindedness.

If my devout Catholic girlfriend can accept other people's faths/beliefs/religion, and Shark can't, I think that's saying something profound. He has the exact kind of behavior which instigated hundreds of years of religious wars and persecutions in the name of God.

I think you are misunderstanding Shark. I haven't read anywhere where he is not accepting of other people's faith, he is just explaining why he believes his is the right one. Everyone who has faith believes they are right, am I correct? Jews and muslims obviously believe that they are right or wouldn't be following their faith. I am sure you are exagerating and I am sure shark would not want a religious war, no one wants that. chuckleshuffle

 

[Husker_x]

Which goes back to what Johnnyrodgers said. The world begins to worship false idols and people turn their backs on God. Your egocentrism will only take you so far. It doesn't matter how smart you are, you will never be greater or more powerful than God, and the fact that you are even saying this is frustrating to say the least.

There's a little thing called humility that everybody should learn at some point in their lives, and it is better learned sooner than later. Bowing down to God, who is far more powerful and amazing than you can ever imagine, is by far the most intelligent act that you can do with your act. So if you're trying to be intelligent, try that route instead.

This is hysterical. Religion is anti-humility. You talk about things as fact for which you admit you have no evidence, then accuse your opponents of egocentrism for having the audacity to ask you to explain yourself. The days where religious people get to spout nonsense in public forums without criticism are over. And not a moment too soon, as far as I'm concerned.

Well, it won't be a moment too soon when secular humanists get criticized for their nonsense in a public forum. One mans trash is another man's treasure. chuckleshuffle

Have at it. I think you'll find it's a bit tougher when your opponent relies on reason and evidence instead of faith and magic to defend their position.

 

[Enhance]

I think you are misunderstanding Shark. I haven't read anywhere where he is not accepting of other people's faith, he is just explaining why he believes his is the right one. Everyone who has faith believes they are right, am I correct? Jews and muslims obviously believe that they are right or wouldn't be following their faith. I am sure you are exagerating and I am sure shark would not want a religious war, no one wants that. chuckleshuffle

This is a direct quote from him.

No other religion has had proof that they are right about their beliefs like Christianity. God sent his only son to Earth so that he could die for our sins. What does that tell you? You're ignorant to believe in anything else.

 

[johnnyrodgers20]

Again, I have nothing to add to this already spot-on point. Kudos, Enhance.

It's just getting ridiculous at this point, Mills. I don't see anybody here asking for proof, or even saying that people can't believe what they want. I've spent this entire thread trying to show the futility and utter arrogance in putting supreme confidence behind one's own beliefs. Yet, no matter what I say, they continue to provide "proof", necessitate their ability to provide proof and defend their narrow viewpoints because it's "faith."

I don't know how many times I can say that people can believe whatever they want, just understand that they could be wrong and others have different view points.

You must remember that also!! :hmmph By the way as science tries to disprove the bible they have actually found some stories may be true (E. G. Sodom and Gomorrah).

 

[HuskerShark]

I think you are misunderstanding Shark. I haven't read anywhere where he is not accepting of other people's faith, he is just explaining why he believes his is the right one. Everyone who has faith believes they are right, am I correct? Jews and muslims obviously believe that they are right or wouldn't be following their faith. I am sure you are exagerating and I am sure shark would not want a religious war, no one wants that. chuckleshuffle

This is a direct quote from him.

No other religion has had proof that they are right about their beliefs like Christianity. God sent his only son to Earth so that he could die for our sins. What does that tell you? You're ignorant to believe in anything else.

Doesn't mean I hate anybody who doesn't believe.

Also doesn't mean that I won't try to get them to believe in Jesus....

 

[knapplc]

Again, I have nothing to add to this already spot-on point. Kudos, Enhance.

It's just getting ridiculous at this point, Mills. I don't see anybody here asking for proof, or even saying that people can't believe what they want. I've spent this entire thread trying to show the futility and utter arrogance in putting supreme confidence behind one's own beliefs. Yet, no matter what I say, they continue to provide "proof", necessitate their ability to provide proof and defend their narrow viewpoints because it's "faith."

I don't know how many times I can say that people can believe whatever they want, just understand that they could be wrong and others have different view points.

You must remember that also!! :hmmph By the way as science tries to disprove the bible they have actually found some stories may be true (E. G. Sodom and Gomorrah).

EVERYONE must remember that. It's OK to have your belief. It's OK for me to have mine. But when we start ridiculing each other for our beliefs, that's when our points of view lose merit.

I'm going to disagree with you and you're going to disagree with me (the generic all-encompassing "you" and "me" BTW), but as long as the discussion is civil and respectful of the beliefs of others, the discussion has merit. Simply bickering back and forth, denegrating others for believing other than you believe, etc. is fruitless and, in fact, counterproductive.

 

[Hoosker]

I think you are misunderstanding Shark. I haven't read anywhere where he is not accepting of other people's faith, he is just explaining why he believes his is the right one. Everyone who has faith believes they are right, am I correct? Jews and muslims obviously believe that they are right or wouldn't be following their faith. I am sure you are exagerating and I am sure shark would not want a religious war, no one wants that. chuckleshuffle

This is a direct quote from him.

No other religion has had proof that they are right about their beliefs like Christianity. God sent his only son to Earth so that he could die for our sins. What does that tell you? You're ignorant to believe in anything else.

Doesn't mean I hate anybody who doesn't believe.

Also doesn't mean that I won't try to get them to believe in Jesus....

Calling someone ignorant for not believing what you believe is pretty hateful, whether you choose to recognize this or not.

 

[knapplc]

Calling someone ignorant for not believing what you believe is pretty hateful, whether you choose to recognize this or not.

You could take it that way, and that is what he said, but isn't it far more likely that what he intended to convey was a firm conviction in his beliefs, and those words weren't the most politick?