I serve an amazing God

[HuskerShark]

2) Why would we want a world filled with rainbows and roses where God solved all of our problems and healed all of our sicknesses? Would it be easy? Hell yeah, it would. But wouldn't that take away a huge part of life? One of the biggest parts of life is overcoming obstacles when life is touchest and pulling through. While I would love to see a world where our loved-ones never get cancer and they live to be old, that would just make the world too perfect and easy. I won't receive a perfect world until I (hopefully) get to heaven after I die.

Count me as someone who isn't interested in living in a world of disease and death for the privilege of overcoming the obstacles. Have a loved one die from cancer and tell us whether you still have this opinion. I'm guessing your mind will change.

Too late.

And you're totally OK with that? That's a bizarre, morbid stance.

If you believe in a God who has the power to take HIS CHILDREN out of this life of suffering and misery but CHOOSES not to, you're nuts.

Once again, you have no idea if God has a greater plan for those people in heaven. Nor do I. I just trust that being all-knowing, He is doing what needs to be done. That's what faith is.

 

[carlfense]

2) Why would we want a world filled with rainbows and roses where God solved all of our problems and healed all of our sicknesses? Would it be easy? Hell yeah, it would. But wouldn't that take away a huge part of life? One of the biggest parts of life is overcoming obstacles when life is touchest and pulling through. While I would love to see a world where our loved-ones never get cancer and they live to be old, that would just make the world too perfect and easy. I won't receive a perfect world until I (hopefully) get to heaven after I die.

Count me as someone who isn't interested in living in a world of disease and death for the privilege of overcoming the obstacles. Have a loved one die from cancer and tell us whether you still have this opinion. I'm guessing your mind will change.

Too late.

And you're totally OK with that? That's a bizarre, morbid stance.

If you believe in a God who has the power to take HIS CHILDREN out of this life of suffering and misery but CHOOSES not to, you're nuts.

Once again, you have no idea if God has a greater plan for those people in heaven. Nor do I. I just trust that being all-knowing, He is doing what needs to be done. That's what faith is.

Then why wouldn't he take them to heaven in the most comfortable manner possible? Does he like inflicting pain?

 

[knapplc]

Once again, you have no idea if God has a greater plan for those people in heaven. Nor do I. I just trust that being all-knowing, He is doing what needs to be done. That's what faith is.

I love this answer. God can do anything to you. Anything. The worst life imaginable, the most heartache, the most unfair, unfulfilled, unwarranted harms can happen to you (and those you love), but it's completely OK. Why? Because God has a greater plan.

 

[Enhance]

2) Why would we want a world filled with rainbows and roses where God solved all of our problems and healed all of our sicknesses? Would it be easy? Hell yeah, it would. But wouldn't that take away a huge part of life? One of the biggest parts of life is overcoming obstacles when life is touchest and pulling through. While I would love to see a world where our loved-ones never get cancer and they live to be old, that would just make the world too perfect and easy. I won't receive a perfect world until I (hopefully) get to heaven after I die.

There's a lot about God that I don't know and it doesn't always make sense, but I think that's the way it was meant to be.

Then, again, I must pose the question - what makes 'God' any better than a tyrant? Tyrants rule and control the lives of the subjects below them, determining whether they live or die based on choices. Isn't this exactly what God is doing? Doesn't that upset you? Doesn't that piss you off? Doesn't it annoy you to know that, no matter the choices you make in life, it doesn't matter, because someone will ultimately always have supreme control over your own choices?

This works back to my biggest problem with a theist God. It requires you to have belief in something that has ultimate control over your life. You could exercise every day, eat healthy and be a devout Christian, and then die in a car accident tomorrow? Can you really be happy with "If that's God's plan for me, so bet it?"

 

[HuskerShark]

2) Why would we want a world filled with rainbows and roses where God solved all of our problems and healed all of our sicknesses? Would it be easy? Hell yeah, it would. But wouldn't that take away a huge part of life? One of the biggest parts of life is overcoming obstacles when life is touchest and pulling through. While I would love to see a world where our loved-ones never get cancer and they live to be old, that would just make the world too perfect and easy. I won't receive a perfect world until I (hopefully) get to heaven after I die.

There's a lot about God that I don't know and it doesn't always make sense, but I think that's the way it was meant to be.

Then, again, I must pose the question - what makes 'God' any better than a tyrant? Tyrants rule and control the lives of the subjects below them, determining whether they live or die based on choices. Isn't this exactly what God is doing? Doesn't that upset you? Doesn't that piss you off? Doesn't it annoy you to know that, no matter the choices you make in life, it doesn't matter, because someone will ultimately always have supreme control over your own choices?

This works back to my biggest problem with a theist God. It requires you to have belief in something that has ultimate control over your life. You could exercise every day, eat healthy and be a devout Christian, and then die in a car accident tomorrow? Can you really be happy with "If that's God's plan for me, so bet it?"

Yes.

 

[Enhance]

2) Why would we want a world filled with rainbows and roses where God solved all of our problems and healed all of our sicknesses? Would it be easy? Hell yeah, it would. But wouldn't that take away a huge part of life? One of the biggest parts of life is overcoming obstacles when life is touchest and pulling through. While I would love to see a world where our loved-ones never get cancer and they live to be old, that would just make the world too perfect and easy. I won't receive a perfect world until I (hopefully) get to heaven after I die.

There's a lot about God that I don't know and it doesn't always make sense, but I think that's the way it was meant to be.

Then, again, I must pose the question - what makes 'God' any better than a tyrant? Tyrants rule and control the lives of the subjects below them, determining whether they live or die based on choices. Isn't this exactly what God is doing? Doesn't that upset you? Doesn't that piss you off? Doesn't it annoy you to know that, no matter the choices you make in life, it doesn't matter, because someone will ultimately always have supreme control over your own choices?

This works back to my biggest problem with a theist God. It requires you to have belief in something that has ultimate control over your life. You could exercise every day, eat healthy and be a devout Christian, and then die in a car accident tomorrow? Can you really be happy with "If that's God's plan for me, so bet it?"

Yes.

I'd still like an answer to what differentiates between God and a tyrant. I'd also like to know why you're OK with having no control over your life. That really doesn't bother you at all, knowing you could die tomorrow for no reason just because 'God wills it?'

 

[knapplc]

The chief danger in a belief system like Shark is describing is this - it's tremendously easy for a human to manipulate someone who has that kind of utterly blind faith. I don't mean blind faith derogatorily - I just mean that if you're that accepting of whatever happens, whatever you're asked to do, then there is no filter. At all.

This is how the Jim Jones's and David Koresh's of the world gain power over people.

 

[HuskerShark]

The chief danger in a belief system like Shark is describing is this - it's tremendously easy for a human to manipulate someone who has that kind of utterly blind faith. I don't mean blind faith derogatorily - I just mean that if you're that accepting of whatever happens, whatever you're asked to do, then there is no filter. At all.

This is how the Jim Jones's and David Koresh's of the world gain power over people.

If you're implying that I've never questioned my faith, then you're wrong. There have been a couple of bad times in my life when I have questioned what I truly believe, and in the end, I always come back to the same thing. Iam not and never have been the kind of person to "blindly follow" anything. If I felt that believing in God was such a ridiculous thing like so many of you seem to think, I wouldn't. Fact of the matter is, I see what the world is and I believe it was the work of God.

 

[tschu]

Biologically, a world without disease and pain and such just isn't really possible for reasons which would take me hours and dozens of posts to try to get all of my thoughts across.

 

[Enhance]

Biologically, a world without disease and pain and such just isn't really possible for reasons which would take me hours and dozens of posts to try to get all of my thoughts across.

Well, if God has the power to heal, but does so on his own whims, then a world without disease and pain is possible. No? It would also mean biology and other sciences are a lie, since God can alter them how he pleases.

This is why I brought up the whole God, tyrant and control over one's life issue. If God has this power and delivers it whenever he feels like it, it's similar to a tyrant. In conjunction, it means we have no control over our lives and are just puppets.

 

[HuskerShark]

Biologically, a world without disease and pain and such just isn't really possible for reasons which would take me hours and dozens of posts to try to get all of my thoughts across.

Well, if God has the power to heal, but does so on his own whims, then a world without disease and pain is possible. No? It would also mean biology and other sciences are a lie, since God can alter them how he pleases.

This is why I brought up the whole God, tyrant and control over one's life issue. If God has this power and delivers it whenever he feels like it, it's similar to a tyrant. In conjunction, it means we have no control over our lives and are just puppets.

If you're a parent with your kid in the grocery store, you have the "power" to buy them every bag of candy their heart desires. Just because you deny them doesn't make you a bad guy. Many times, it means you are a good parent.

 

[tschu]

Biologically, a world without disease and pain and such just isn't really possible for reasons which would take me hours and dozens of posts to try to get all of my thoughts across.

Well, if God has the power to heal, but does so on his own whims, then a world without disease and pain is possible. No? It would also mean biology and other sciences are a lie, since God can alter them how he pleases.

This is why I brought up the whole God, tyrant and control over one's life issue. If God has this power and delivers it whenever he feels like it, it's similar to a tyrant. In conjunction, it means we have no control over our lives and are just puppets.

If God had the ability to do so and has been doing so, we'd have evidence. (Wow, this is why I hate debating this.) And right now we have a pretty darn good understanding of how the universe works. Until we see something to the contrary, I have no reason to debate this.

For a world without, say, bacterial disease, all bacteria that are harmful or potentially harmful to humans would have to be eradicated. In addition, all bacteria that could potentially mutate to become harmful to humans (which isn't hard because bacteria can mutate very quickly and can even transfer DNA between each other, altering their genomes) would have to be wiped out, or altered so that they could not affect humans. Literally every single bacterial cell on earth. When you affect all of these bacteria or kill them, you're altering the global ecosystem in an almost incomprehensible way, since bacteria make up such a large percentage of all life on earth. The result would be mass extinctions. This is just one tiny example. For God to bring a world without pain or disease would mean to completely shatter everything that we know about the universe from thousands of years of scientific study. If you choose to believe that God is a puppet who controls everything on earth, just know that every single piece of scientific work in human history contradicts that.

 

[Enhance]

Shark, as I posted above, denying your child an ice cream cone and choosing whether or not to cure a person's cancer are two very, very different things. They're vastly incomparable.

 

[Enhance]

Biologically, a world without disease and pain and such just isn't really possible for reasons which would take me hours and dozens of posts to try to get all of my thoughts across.

Well, if God has the power to heal, but does so on his own whims, then a world without disease and pain is possible. No? It would also mean biology and other sciences are a lie, since God can alter them how he pleases.

This is why I brought up the whole God, tyrant and control over one's life issue. If God has this power and delivers it whenever he feels like it, it's similar to a tyrant. In conjunction, it means we have no control over our lives and are just puppets.

If God had the ability to do so and has been doing so, we'd have evidence. (Wow, this is why I hate debating this.) And right now we have a pretty darn good understanding of how the universe works. Until we see something to the contrary, I have no reason to debate this.

For a world without, say, bacterial disease, all bacteria that are harmful or potentially harmful to humans would have to be eradicated. In addition, all bacteria that could potentially mutate to become harmful to humans (which isn't hard because bacteria can mutate very quickly and can even transfer DNA between each other, altering their genomes) would have to be wiped out, or altered so that they could not affect humans. Literally every single bacterial cell on earth. When you affect all of these bacteria or kill them, you're altering the global ecosystem in an almost incomprehensible way, since bacteria make up such a large percentage of all life on earth. The result would be mass extinctions. This is just one tiny example. For God to bring a world without pain or disease would mean to completely shatter everything that we know about the universe from thousands of years of scientific study. If you choose to believe that God is a puppet who controls everything on earth, just know that every single piece of scientific work in human history contradicts that.

But, he's 'God', with control over everything. Wouldn't he be able to alter anything as he chooses and it would be OK? It doesn't matter if destroying every bacteria would result in mass extinctions, because 'God' could hypothetically divert this issue, if he really has as much control as some people insinuate.

What you're saying, though, supports my idea that 'God' doesn't have control. If he really does, it's vastly unfair and at odds with the world.

 

[tschu]

But, he's 'God', with control over everything. Wouldn't he be able to alter anything as he chooses and it would be OK? It doesn't matter if destroying every bacteria would result in mass extinctions, because 'God' could hypothetically divert this issue, if he really has as much control as some people insinuate.

What you're saying, though, supports my idea that 'God' doesn't have control. If he really does, it's vastly unfair and at odds with the world.

Exactly. But then we would find evidence for God acting as a puppet. We would be able to say, here is how things worked. Now we're free of disease, hooray! But all of this other stuff isn't acting like it should given the circumstances. Therefore, God must exist. I'm just pointing out how if God is a puppet who controls everything, then he's sure putting the universe on cruise control right now. If he was messing around with our everyday lives we would have evidence for him pulling the puppet strings - there would be things that just wildly wouldn't add up.