Advice from you guys

BIGREDIOWAN

BIGREDIOWAN

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So I found out some real shady sh#t was going on with my pay and the other Sergeants pay last night at work.

I tested for Sergeant coming up on 4 years ago, originally the other Sergeant was a salaried employee and no one wanted to test for the position when we got approval for a 2nd Sergeant. The other Sergeant wrote a big letter up saying that our pay needed to be changed to hourly and that we needed to be able to work overtime and get paid for it, accrue our vacation time the same as officers, and we needed to stay 6 or 7% above the officers we supervise for obvious reasons. At the time the city council agreed to this and I tested for Sergeant with this understanding and ultimately got the position. As far as I know there was an agreement with the city council and city manager at the time and I'm assuming that this agreement was put into writing by the Chief of Police, I'm looking into the City Council meeting minutes from that time. Since that agreement we have a slightly different city council and a new city manager as the other one retired.

So I received a new timecard for the new year, in the upper right hand corner of this card instead of it saying "hourly employee" it now says "EXEMPT" it also no longer has spots to write down overtime, holiday time accrual and comp time accrual. It just gives one hourly wage now instead of other options depending on what you work. I noticed on my check I was supposed to get a raise on January 1st, but didn't get that raise. Our payroll clerk is dumb as hell and screws our checks up all the time so I figured that was where the issue was. I started putting two and two together and asked the other Sergeant if he was having the same problem? He said he observed the same thing and said something to the Chief about this last Friday. Here comes the sh**ty part......................

So the Chief tells him that he knew that they kept our wage the same and that our new city manager isn't wanting to give us that wage since we aren't union employees. She thinks we shouldn't get the same raises that the officers get even though there is an agreement that says we have to stay a certain percentage above the officers since we changed the position from salaried employee to hourly employee. Apparently someone thinks we were stupid enough that we wouldn't find this out and I find it amazing that neither the Chief or Assistant Chief let either of us know anything and the Chief even spoke with me Monday and said, "Your timecard says EXEMPT in the upper right hand corner, that means non-union employee" but he didn't say anything about the pay part which is evasive and shady IMO. I have no idea if I have any legal leg to stand on since I'm not a union employee, but with that agreement in place I imagine that I would have a gripe on some level.

I'm trying to stay calm about the situation, but I just realized last night that apparently my bosses don't give a f#*k about me enough to tell me about this sh#t back in December. It appears that I may lose 88 hours of holiday time and comp time that I accrued since I'm not an hourly employee anymore either. If I don't get written up and/or suspended today it'll be a miracle.............

What do you think about it?

 
Between a rock and a hard place. Don't ya just love middle management.

You definitely need to find all the documentation you can for any stated wages/benefits stipulated regarding your position. They should not be able to change your job description or benefit package without first asking your input/telling you they are changing it. There might/should be a memorandum of understanding regarding your position as well.

You may not have a lot of bargaining power in that position but all employees have rights regarding their employment status and due process. You may have legal steps available to you for getting your holiday/comp time but you could also burn all the bridges at that Department in the process. Upper management frowns upon whistle blowers/ boat rockers :)

 
I have the resume that I can go anywhere I want in law enforcement, it's really that simple. If I wanted to go federal, I could, if I wanted to be a Chief I get my Master's and I could where I go is up to me. So I really don't care if I burn the bridges here or not................my boss doesn't have much clout in this area in reference to law enforcement.

 
Whoa, whoa. You always care if you burn bridges. Don't burn bridges. You don't know if one of your current bosses/colleagues went to school or some training convention with the guy you just interviewed with and could get a phone call asking about you. There's no reason to submarine a potential new gig because you don't like or respect the people at the place you're leaving now. Always keep those bridges intact - even if you're not best buddies with them.

Regarding your salary issue... as an at-will employee they can do what they did to your wages without your consent. They're going to do anything they can to save money, because I presume, like everywhere, they're under a budget and that budget is likely shrinking.

It's not cool how they pulled this stunt. They should have talked to you, at least given you a heads-up. But even though they pulled a d!(k move on you, don't vent on them. Talk to your captain as reasonably as you can. Tell him you're upset about it, but don't go off on him. It may be satisfying to vent, but the ramifications aren't worth it.

If your resume is up to scratch, it may be a good time to start looking. And be up-front about it with your superiors. They may want to keep you, and they may bend on some of these changes.

 
It all depends on the "agreement" that the Sergeants had with the City and whether or not it expired. If there is an actual agreement you may not be classified as at will. You and your fellow Sergeants need to follow your chain of command and see what or who changed your status from hourly to exempt. The City may decide that you and your co-Sergeants are a valuable resource and not worth losing.

 
The agreement didn't have an expiration date, it was a permanent change to the position. Lance, while I get what you're saying what they did has NEVER been done before around here and is a big no no. They burnt their bridges with me, not the other way around. Historically speaking certain supervisory positions in law enforcement have always been salary while other have been hourly on some level. Sergeants are typically hourly, once you get into Lieutenants and above it turns to salary. The biggest issue is that they didn't let us know at all and my bosses didn't even let me know, I had to find it out on my own through investigation. I've never left anywhere on bad terms and they can't say one bad thing about my job performance. I've bent over backwards to improve that department and there is zero way they can deny that. I have 10 officers that will back me in that respect..............

 
Lance does have a valid point about burning your bridges. My son's department is huge and word gets around like wildfire. And nothing stops a phone conversation from happening(prospective employer to current employer) even though it may contain proscribed questions and answers.

 
This really just restates what Rick and Lance have said, but:

1. Unfortunately, absent a contract (which is all a union person has, through the collective bargining agreement), an employer can pretty much change the terms and conditions of work at any time. In a municipal setting, it is possible that you have protections through the grievance/mediation process. Or, there is an ordinance that sets terms and conditions for job classifications. Most state employment has something like that - class grades with minimum and maximum salary and benefits, and a grievance process if you are denied them. But if not, I'm afraid you're out of luck.

2. I know you feel you've been shafted - and you have. And I know you have folks that can substantiate your job performance, but Rick and Lance are correct - don't burn bridges. Guys that you believe will corroborate your performance can suddenly get cold feet when they realize that supporting you could cost them their job. And while blacklists may not exist, as noted all it takes is a phone call to the right person to cause you grief. It may not happen for all postitions you would apply for - but if it happens in the one you REALLY want, that's enought.

I really wish I could offer some good advice or words of encouragement, but I'm afraid that I can't. As a relatively recent example, look at what happened to the union state employees in Wisconsin.

 
FYI, we had a good discussion today and both of my bosses apologized to me for not telling us sooner. They were hoping that the situation would be resolved before we found out about it so it would appear everything was normal. Obviously that didn't work out in their favor.............................we are in the process of doing a document request in reference to all the agreements and then we'll go into grievance mode. If that doesn't work litigation is all we'll have left................

 
AR Husker Fan said:
This really just restates what Rick and Lance have said, but:

1. Unfortunately, absent a contract (which is all a union person has, through the collective bargining agreement), an employer can pretty much change the terms and conditions of work at any time. In a municipal setting, it is possible that you have protections through the grievance/mediation process. Or, there is an ordinance that sets terms and conditions for job classifications. Most state employment has something like that - class grades with minimum and maximum salary and benefits, and a grievance process if you are denied them. But if not, I'm afraid you're out of luck.

2. I know you feel you've been shafted - and you have. And I know you have folks that can substantiate your job performance, but Rick and Lance are correct - don't burn bridges. Guys that you believe will corroborate your performance can suddenly get cold feet when they realize that supporting you could cost them their job. And while blacklists may not exist, as noted all it takes is a phone call to the right person to cause you grief. It may not happen for all postitions you would apply for - but if it happens in the one you REALLY want, that's enought.

I really wish I could offer some good advice or words of encouragement, but I'm afraid that I can't. As a relatively recent example, look at what happened to the union state employees in Wisconsin.
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My bosses support us 100% and think it's bullsh#t...................they just can't do anything about it cause it's above their heads. They gave us some helpful "advice" reference how to proceed from here.............."hint hint" "wink wink"

 
Something that Frank said reminded me - if I had $1 for every time a Complainant told me that "Bob the Witness" would corroborate their story, only to have Bob suddenly become deaf, dumb and stupid, I'd be retired by now. Those folks who say they will testify for you tend to think differently when the questions are being asked. I'm sure you're familiar with that during investigations, Trevor. The bravest guy can suddenly become an entirely different person in that situation. I've seen it a million times.

Frank's also right about the grievance, and CBA stuff. Those are your best options, and whether your bosses are on your side or not (and it's great they are), the very last resort is to burn your bridges with them. Better to leave the job knowing you're right but you got shafted than to let them have both barrels. No matter how high in the chain of command you go, do your best to keep a calm, level head. Approach it like a combative drunk at a traffic stop. Just keep it all business, and let them be the a-hole if that's what they want to do.

Having said that, it's great you superiors are working with you on this. Makes your position easier to stomach, even if it's still a shaft.

Keep us updated. Hopefully this works out for you.

 
So I was checking out FLSA stuff last night, which is thrilling by the way, and we don't meet the criteria of an "EXEMPT" employee like our city administrator is trying to claim. We have no power in reference to hiring and firing and we only meet some of the other criteria not all of the criteria like it says. You must meet ALL the criteria to be considered "EXEMPT" and then they can basically make you a salaried employee and there is nothing you can do about it. So that covers the EXEMPT issue part of this whole thing. The city council had a formal agreement with both us from July 2009 on how we would be paid. We would maintain the percentage buffer above the officers and to maintain this percentage we would mirror them in reference to their union contract. Her position is we aren't union so she doesn't need to follow the union contract. While true about us being non-union there is a documented agreement with the city council on this issue that she made no attempt to change. She just arbitrarily decided not to give us our raise on January 1st without any notice and without any attempt to change the agreement. This agreement was made with the backing of a study that was paid for and done by a local company in deciding whether the way we were going to be paid was fair and right. Our job was decided to be 80% patrol work, 20% office work which allowed us to be paid as a hourly waged employee since our main responsibilities are patrol and not management this is how they came to this conclusion. So to me with these documents, the backing of the FLSA I don't see how she can "legally" change our wages without first changing the agreement and notifying us of this change. AR from a legal standpoint what do you see now that I've explained it a little bit more in detail? We are going to city hall today to request copies of the city council meeting minutes from around that time to include with our grievance.

 
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Was there a term to that agreement you had with the city council from 2009? Could that agreement be modified without your knowledge or consent?

I presume you have a copy of that agreement, and you need to go over that thing with a fine-tooth comb if you haven't already.

 
No, there was no term expiration date, it was a standing agreement that the Chief wanted for the Sergeant position with the intentions that it would be a permanent change. I have asked for a copy of this document from the Chief and he is gladly providing us with a copy of this document, along with the copy of the study that was done in reference to our position and that document explains our position in reference to FLSA. I have no idea whether it can be modified without our knowledge, but I'm almost positive she can't change a decision that the city council made without taking it in front of the city council first and explaining her position. Then the city council would make a decision based on all the facts. I'm almost certain they wouldn't change the pay for our position because this is basically the same council that was sitting in 2009 when this decision was made. It would also effect the fire captains as they are hourly employees as well and this city basically sucks the fire department off and gives them whatever they want. So if they changed our pay for our position their positions are similar in duties to ours and what they do, so the city would have to be fair and change their pay as well or face allegations of either discrimination or unfairness in their tactics and choices. I would gladly bring that to the public's attention on some level as the public is tired of the fire department getting everything and the police department and all the other departments are taking a back seat.

Nevermind the fact that there is a conflict of interest with the city council as two of the five members are PAID on-call firefighters for the city which is why the fire department is getting whatever they want. It's only a matter of time before our county attorney says enough is enough with that crap. The city handbook states that "employees of the City of Norwalk can't serve in an official capacity with the city council." I thought that if you were paid by a place you were basically an employee of that place, but apparently I have no idea what I'm talking about..............

 
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