Strange Things Ive Noticed Lately

[sd'sker]

Tommie Frazier did ride the pine behind Mike Grant for 6 weeks.

and how did tommie's nfl career pan out? case-in-point. (i really do not know what we are talking about).

It was more about True's question as to if the lower classman are better, why werent they playing to begin with. I think Tommie is a perfect example. Some guys just need a little longer to grow. Doesnt mean they aint gonna be better, or even a sh#t ton better.

i agree. i also think that bo deferred to experience over athleticism. that needs to change and i think it will.

 

[beanman]

Some people just can't grasp the concept that when you hire a first time head coach late in the recruiting process there is a chance his first recruiting class isn't going to be as productive as some would hope. In this case, that carried over somewhat into the next class also.

In college, those classes have to wash through the system. It's not like in the NFL where we could go out and get a bunch of free agents the next year to replace them. This graduating class of seniors is not indicative of the health of the program by any stretch of the imagination.

You don't necessarily have to let those classes wash through the system. There's no rules against starting underclassmen. We had no qualms with starting Martinez, Turner, Bell, ect. over upperclassmen on the offensive side of the ball, and our team benefited greatly because of it. Why is it such a no-no on defense?

Guys running around pre-snap like they don't know where to line up should be your first clue.

 

[NUinID]

Fact is, yeah, we knew a few of these guys were terrible. Meredith, Steinkuhler, Compton, and in my opinion Stafford should not have been starting players at a Division 1 University like Nebraska. Yet, the NFL scouts didn't highly value guys I thought were pretty good ball players like Burkhead, Martin, Reed, and Cotton. So I just have to agree to disagree with those NFL scouts. I hope those players prove them wrong.

Here's the problem. Every one of these guys that was eligible for the draft a week ago was a former starter at their position last year correct? Meaning, they started over somebody who is on the current roster ? Correct?

Which leads me to two questions in my mind. Please explain to me why some of you have such a hard time seeing that if the best talent scouts in the world don't think these guys were worth sh#t, yet this entire class is made up of former starters...........How is it that does not reflect somewhat poorly on the guys behind them? Not adding up to me? To simplify it as much as possible.....if they suck, but they were better than you, then doesn't that mean you suck more? One would have to believe that purely by logic.

Second problem. Let's say for instance, EZ-E is right, and somehow these guys that we know nothing about, and haven't played more than a handful of snaps at this level, are somehow going to blow the lid off their future NFL drafts. These guys are just gonna make this NFL draft class a fluke, a long forgotten memory, never to be seen again. Well then wouldn't one have to think, if these guys are so damn good, what the f#*k are they doing riding the pine behind this class of Undrafted free agents? Doesn't make sense. You can try to pretend it makes sense, but it doesn't so I refuse to listen to any arguments that state otherwise.

Fact is, these young players "on the come" as Bo puts it ( God I hate that saying) might be, and in my belief, probably are more talented than the group of guys that just left. But what factual basis do we stand on when we say that. Really, we just hope to hell they are better. We want to believe it because let's face it, last year we got our asses kicked pretty severely at times. If they are better, then what the f#*k are they doing on the sidelines? That is also a problem. It's got to be fixed. You can write this draft off as nothing more than a fluke, with no indication of the future what so ever. But some of you act like you can't even connect the dots and see how one would come to the conclusion that maybe we don't have a lot of talent on this roster, which.........we do.

I'll give it a try and use examples. Not every good player in college is a good fit for pro football.

Example 1. Ed Steward, and Troy Dumas were starting LBs on NU's 1994 National Championship team. Steward was an 1st team AA and a Butkus award finalist. He never to my knowledge played a down in the NFL.

Example 2. Doug Coleman was an LB on that also and even started about half the games that year until he was over taken by Phil Ellis who started the rest of the year and all the next year at MLB. Ellis never played a down in the NFL but Coleman played 5-6 years in the NFL.

Example 3. Jay Forman played LB on from 95' to 98' he then played 7-8 years of pro ball. He started at Will LB as a RSFr, but then was moved to being a backup at MLB behind Jon Hesse. Why wasn't he playing in front of Hesse who I believe was originally a walk-on.

I can go on and on with examples like this, but what the use, you refuse to listen to arguments that state otherwise. :ahhhhhhhh

 

[The Dude]

Some people just can't grasp the concept that when you hire a first time head coach late in the recruiting process there is a chance his first recruiting class isn't going to be as productive as some would hope. In this case, that carried over somewhat into the next class also.

In college, those classes have to wash through the system. It's not like in the NFL where we could go out and get a bunch of free agents the next year to replace them. This graduating class of seniors is not indicative of the health of the program by any stretch of the imagination.

You don't necessarily have to let those classes wash through the system. There's no rules against starting underclassmen. We had no qualms with starting Martinez, Turner, Bell, ect. over upperclassmen on the offensive side of the ball, and our team benefited greatly because of it. Why is it such a no-no on defense?

Guys running around pre-snap like they don't know where to line up should be your first clue.

We didn't get such a clue, since we're talking about guys who were on the bench.

 

[beanman]

Hey guys how's everybody?

Couple things I've noticed are some just odd opinions and viewpoints that hopefully I can help put into perspective.

1) People claim we don't have NFL talent.

It was evident that we didn't have any seniors that were worthy of being drafted. In my opinion, that is correct. We didn't recruit very well in 08 and 09. Those would have been this years seniors. Don't make the mistake that we don't have NFL talent in the lower classes though. We have players that will be drafted. Just not in the 2013 draft.

2) We haven't developed the kids we have.

I don't believe you should use a draft class as proof of that. After Eric Martin's sophomore year I as on record saying he would never have a major impact on our team. He developed into a good college defensive end that I would take back for this year. Jake Cotton is a kid that will be drafted as is Spencer Long and they were both nowhere near as highly touted as Andrew Rodriguez. These are just very small examples, but my point stands that the 2013 draft class does not indicate how we are developing our young men.

3) Our scheme on defense isn't one that will win games

Listen, Les Miles before he hired Bo said that he was one of the toughest DCs to gameplan for because his scheme changes with the way he wants to go at offenses. In my opinion, we did not have the horses to run what Bo wants. That stems back to the 08 and 09 class. Which ultimately you have to hold Bo accountable for and he has accepted the blame. Patience is what I will tell you.

4) Our Coaching Staff isn't competent

Well, based on points one and two, shouldn't we credit the coaching staff's schemes week in and week out that allowed us to win games against teams with more experienced NFL draftees??? I don't think it's unfair to ask.

Cheers guys

Wow, way to go out on a limb there.

 

[beanman]

Some people just can't grasp the concept that when you hire a first time head coach late in the recruiting process there is a chance his first recruiting class isn't going to be as productive as some would hope. In this case, that carried over somewhat into the next class also.

In college, those classes have to wash through the system. It's not like in the NFL where we could go out and get a bunch of free agents the next year to replace them. This graduating class of seniors is not indicative of the health of the program by any stretch of the imagination.

You don't necessarily have to let those classes wash through the system. There's no rules against starting underclassmen. We had no qualms with starting Martinez, Turner, Bell, ect. over upperclassmen on the offensive side of the ball, and our team benefited greatly because of it. Why is it such a no-no on defense?

Guys running around pre-snap like they don't know where to line up should be your first clue.

We didn't get such a clue, since we're talking about guys who were on the bench.

What I'm saying is if the upper classmen can't make the reads, then how can you expect a frosh or sophomore to do it.

 

[The Dude]

What I'm saying is if the upper classmen can't make the reads, then how can you expect a frosh or sophomore to do it.

If the upperclassman can't do it anyway, then what exactly is the problem with playing a more talented player?

 

[beanman]

Fact is, yeah, we knew a few of these guys were terrible. Meredith, Steinkuhler, Compton, and in my opinion Stafford should not have been starting players at a Division 1 University like Nebraska. Yet, the NFL scouts didn't highly value guys I thought were pretty good ball players like Burkhead, Martin, Reed, and Cotton. So I just have to agree to disagree with those NFL scouts. I hope those players prove them wrong.

Here's the problem. Every one of these guys that was eligible for the draft a week ago was a former starter at their position last year correct? Meaning, they started over somebody who is on the current roster ? Correct?

Which leads me to two questions in my mind. Please explain to me why some of you have such a hard time seeing that if the best talent scouts in the world don't think these guys were worth sh#t, yet this entire class is made up of former starters...........How is it that does not reflect somewhat poorly on the guys behind them? Not adding up to me? To simplify it as much as possible.....if they suck, but they were better than you, then doesn't that mean you suck more? One would have to believe that purely by logic.

Second problem. Let's say for instance, EZ-E is right, and somehow these guys that we know nothing about, and haven't played more than a handful of snaps at this level, are somehow going to blow the lid off their future NFL drafts. These guys are just gonna make this NFL draft class a fluke, a long forgotten memory, never to be seen again. Well then wouldn't one have to think, if these guys are so damn good, what the f#*k are they doing riding the pine behind this class of Undrafted free agents? Doesn't make sense. You can try to pretend it makes sense, but it doesn't so I refuse to listen to any arguments that state otherwise.

Fact is, these young players "on the come" as Bo puts it ( God I hate that saying) might be, and in my belief, probably are more talented than the group of guys that just left. But what factual basis do we stand on when we say that. Really, we just hope to hell they are better. We want to believe it because let's face it, last year we got our asses kicked pretty severely at times. If they are better, then what the f#*k are they doing on the sidelines? That is also a problem. It's got to be fixed. You can write this draft off as nothing more than a fluke, with no indication of the future what so ever. But some of you act like you can't even connect the dots and see how one would come to the conclusion that maybe we don't have a lot of talent on this roster, which.........we do.

I'll give it a try and use examples. Not every good player in college is a good fit for pro football.

Example 1. Ed Steward, and Troy Dumas were starting LBs on NU's 1994 National Championship team. Steward was an 1st team AA and a Butkus award finalist. He never to my knowledge played a down in the NFL.

Example 2. Doug Coleman was an LB on that also and even started about half the games that year until he was over taken by Phil Ellis who started the rest of the year and all the next year at MLB. Ellis never played a down in the NFL but Coleman played 5-6 years in the NFL.

Example 3. Jay Forman played LB on from 95' to 98' he then played 7-8 years of pro ball. He started at Will LB as a RSFr, but then was moved to being a backup at MLB behind Jon Hesse. Why wasn't he playing in front of Hesse who I believe was originally a walk-on.

I can go on and on with examples like this, but what the use, you refuse to listen to arguments that state otherwise. :ahhhhhhhh

I'm pretty sure Jay Forman got into some hot water with the coaches or something. I distinctly remember one of the broadcasters of one of our televised games talking about why he lost his starting position. I was never impressed with Ed Stewart, but perhaps I'm in the minority there. I'll give ya the Phil Ellis one I guess, but from my recollection they both played a lot of snaps, just as our D line did in those days when they had enough depth to keep everyone rotating in and fresh.

 

[KJ.]

Pelini hasn't shown he can run an effective defense that doesn't have top level NFL talent. LSU, Oklahoma, and here all his top defenses had multiple first round talent. Pelini so far has shown he's an average defensive coach, that only excels with top talent. This year will be a test as how good of a d-coach he is.

Honest question - how many coaches excel with bad talent?

Excel? No one. But there's plenty who do just as well as Bo's Suh-less defenses with much less talent.

I think the point the "Bo needs talent to be great" crowd is trying to make is more about the slope of the output vs talent graph than its direction. There isn't a coach in the country who gets better with less talent, that much is obvious. But Bo seems to get better at an increasing rate with more talent, which also means he gets worse at an increasing rate with less talent.

 

[beanman]

What I'm saying is if the upper classmen can't make the reads, then how can you expect a frosh or sophomore to do it.

If the upperclassman can't do it anyway, then what exactly is the problem with playing a more talented player?

You'd have to ask the coaches that. I think we agree man.

 

[MichiganDad3]

I like rolos too. Anyways, we don't disagree landlord. My point is more toward the people who in no way associate this class with the current roster. Those people are wrong. It is a reflection of the roster until this roster PROVES otherwise. We can be optimistic but basing that optimism on any factual foundation is not possible. None of these guys have played! Didn't we lose 9 starters? The athleticism is there, but athleticism alone doesn't make a football player. Though it is about 80%. Fact is these guys might have more to start wih, but they rode the bench last year. Get em out there. Athleticism can disguise a lot of mistakes. I mean, Bo claimed Lavonte David was lost his entire career here. He sure didn't look lost to me.

I wish the defense had 11 starters who are lost.

 

[EZ-E]

Hey guys how's everybody?

Couple things I've noticed are some just odd opinions and viewpoints that hopefully I can help put into perspective.

1) People claim we don't have NFL talent.

It was evident that we didn't have any seniors that were worthy of being drafted. In my opinion, that is correct. We didn't recruit very well in 08 and 09. Those would have been this years seniors. Don't make the mistake that we don't have NFL talent in the lower classes though. We have players that will be drafted. Just not in the 2013 draft.

2) We haven't developed the kids we have.

I don't believe you should use a draft class as proof of that. After Eric Martin's sophomore year I as on record saying he would never have a major impact on our team. He developed into a good college defensive end that I would take back for this year. Jake Cotton is a kid that will be drafted as is Spencer Long and they were both nowhere near as highly touted as Andrew Rodriguez. These are just very small examples, but my point stands that the 2013 draft class does not indicate how we are developing our young men.

3) Our scheme on defense isn't one that will win games

Listen, Les Miles before he hired Bo said that he was one of the toughest DCs to gameplan for because his scheme changes with the way he wants to go at offenses. In my opinion, we did not have the horses to run what Bo wants. That stems back to the 08 and 09 class. Which ultimately you have to hold Bo accountable for and he has accepted the blame. Patience is what I will tell you.

4) Our Coaching Staff isn't competent

Well, based on points one and two, shouldn't we credit the coaching staff's schemes week in and week out that allowed us to win games against teams with more experienced NFL draftees??? I don't think it's unfair to ask.

Cheers guys

Wow, way to go out on a limb there.

... What?????

 

[MichiganDad3]

Fact is, yeah, we knew a few of these guys were terrible. Meredith, Steinkuhler, Compton, and in my opinion Stafford should not have been starting players at a Division 1 University like Nebraska. Yet, the NFL scouts didn't highly value guys I thought were pretty good ball players like Burkhead, Martin, Reed, and Cotton. So I just have to agree to disagree with those NFL scouts. I hope those players prove them wrong.

Here's the problem. Every one of these guys that was eligible for the draft a week ago was a former starter at their position last year correct? Meaning, they started over somebody who is on the current roster ? Correct?

Which leads me to two questions in my mind. Please explain to me why some of you have such a hard time seeing that if the best talent scouts in the world don't think these guys were worth sh#t, yet this entire class is made up of former starters...........How is it that does not reflect somewhat poorly on the guys behind them? Not adding up to me? To simplify it as much as possible.....if they suck, but they were better than you, then doesn't that mean you suck more? One would have to believe that purely by logic.

Second problem. Let's say for instance, EZ-E is right, and somehow these guys that we know nothing about, and haven't played more than a handful of snaps at this level, are somehow going to blow the lid off their future NFL drafts. These guys are just gonna make this NFL draft class a fluke, a long forgotten memory, never to be seen again. Well then wouldn't one have to think, if these guys are so damn good, what the f#*k are they doing riding the pine behind this class of Undrafted free agents? Doesn't make sense. You can try to pretend it makes sense, but it doesn't so I refuse to listen to any arguments that state otherwise.

Fact is, these young players "on the come" as Bo puts it ( God I hate that saying) might be, and in my belief, probably are more talented than the group of guys that just left. But what factual basis do we stand on when we say that. Really, we just hope to hell they are better. We want to believe it because let's face it, last year we got our asses kicked pretty severely at times. If they are better, then what the f#*k are they doing on the sidelines? That is also a problem. It's got to be fixed. You can write this draft off as nothing more than a fluke, with no indication of the future what so ever. But some of you act like you can't even connect the dots and see how one would come to the conclusion that maybe we don't have a lot of talent on this roster, which.........we do.

I'll give it a try and use examples. Not every good player in college is a good fit for pro football.

Example 1. Ed Steward, and Troy Dumas were starting LBs on NU's 1994 National Championship team. Steward was an 1st team AA and a Butkus award finalist. He never to my knowledge played a down in the NFL.

Example 2. Doug Coleman was an LB on that also and even started about half the games that year until he was over taken by Phil Ellis who started the rest of the year and all the next year at MLB. Ellis never played a down in the NFL but Coleman played 5-6 years in the NFL.

Example 3. Jay Forman played LB on from 95' to 98' he then played 7-8 years of pro ball. He started at Will LB as a RSFr, but then was moved to being a backup at MLB behind Jon Hesse. Why wasn't he playing in front of Hesse who I believe was originally a walk-on.

I can go on and on with examples like this, but what the use, you refuse to listen to arguments that state otherwise. :ahhhhhhhh

A coach playing a less talented player is forgiven the minute the team wins the national title.

 

[beanman]

Hey guys how's everybody?

Couple things I've noticed are some just odd opinions and viewpoints that hopefully I can help put into perspective.

1) People claim we don't have NFL talent.

It was evident that we didn't have any seniors that were worthy of being drafted. In my opinion, that is correct. We didn't recruit very well in 08 and 09. Those would have been this years seniors. Don't make the mistake that we don't have NFL talent in the lower classes though. We have players that will be drafted. Just not in the 2013 draft.

2) We haven't developed the kids we have.

I don't believe you should use a draft class as proof of that. After Eric Martin's sophomore year I as on record saying he would never have a major impact on our team. He developed into a good college defensive end that I would take back for this year. Jake Cotton is a kid that will be drafted as is Spencer Long and they were both nowhere near as highly touted as Andrew Rodriguez. These are just very small examples, but my point stands that the 2013 draft class does not indicate how we are developing our young men.

3) Our scheme on defense isn't one that will win games

Listen, Les Miles before he hired Bo said that he was one of the toughest DCs to gameplan for because his scheme changes with the way he wants to go at offenses. In my opinion, we did not have the horses to run what Bo wants. That stems back to the 08 and 09 class. Which ultimately you have to hold Bo accountable for and he has accepted the blame. Patience is what I will tell you.

4) Our Coaching Staff isn't competent

Well, based on points one and two, shouldn't we credit the coaching staff's schemes week in and week out that allowed us to win games against teams with more experienced NFL draftees??? I don't think it's unfair to ask.

Cheers guys

Only one team in the Big 10 had more than 3 draft picks(Illinois). Don't act like the talent on the teams we beat is head and shoulders above ours. The only position you could make a case for is at defensive tackle.

 

[EZ-E]

Hey guys how's everybody?

Couple things I've noticed are some just odd opinions and viewpoints that hopefully I can help put into perspective.

1) People claim we don't have NFL talent.

It was evident that we didn't have any seniors that were worthy of being drafted. In my opinion, that is correct. We didn't recruit very well in 08 and 09. Those would have been this years seniors. Don't make the mistake that we don't have NFL talent in the lower classes though. We have players that will be drafted. Just not in the 2013 draft.

2) We haven't developed the kids we have.

I don't believe you should use a draft class as proof of that. After Eric Martin's sophomore year I as on record saying he would never have a major impact on our team. He developed into a good college defensive end that I would take back for this year. Jake Cotton is a kid that will be drafted as is Spencer Long and they were both nowhere near as highly touted as Andrew Rodriguez. These are just very small examples, but my point stands that the 2013 draft class does not indicate how we are developing our young men.

3) Our scheme on defense isn't one that will win games

Listen, Les Miles before he hired Bo said that he was one of the toughest DCs to gameplan for because his scheme changes with the way he wants to go at offenses. In my opinion, we did not have the horses to run what Bo wants. That stems back to the 08 and 09 class. Which ultimately you have to hold Bo accountable for and he has accepted the blame. Patience is what I will tell you.

4) Our Coaching Staff isn't competent

Well, based on points one and two, shouldn't we credit the coaching staff's schemes week in and week out that allowed us to win games against teams with more experienced NFL draftees??? I don't think it's unfair to ask.

Cheers guys

Only one team in the Big 10 had more than 3 draft picks(Illinois). Don't act like the talent on the teams we beat is head and shoulders above ours. The only position you could make a case for is at defensive tackle.

Forgive me if I'm wrong here, but weren't you complaining midseason about the lack of talent on our team.