Banker's D

[The Dude]

Gangwish deserves a lot of credit for persevering, working hard, and putting him in a spot to lead the defense as a Blackshirt. I am sure it sucks for him to finally reach that level, and then get hurt. I am sure he will also tell you that he didn't play all that great on Saturday.

I do think it's crappy for grown men to be super critical of college aged ball players. I will try to limit myself of being so critical.

You are right, he would tell you that, because he's never satisfied. I'm not dumb I never said he played great either.

About his spin move on the last play. If you look, when he engages the tackle, he chose to spin inside because of the RB got on his outside shoulder. It was his only option. Also, BYU had 7 to block 3. Not making his spin move wouldn't have made any difference because of BYU's protection design. If you wanna blame someone. Blame Banker for only bringing 3.

Yes, there is plenty of blame to go around on the Hail Mary. Banker only brought 3 rushers. The DB didn't get a jam on the WR who caught the ball and allowed a free release. Too many defenders got caught behind the front receiver.

The too many defenders getting behind the front receiver thing isn't really a thing. Both BYU guys in the end zone had a defender directly in front of and behind them, plus two jumpers, which was all set up correctly. Kalu was supposed to be directly behind the front receiver, but was about 5 yards out of position, which maybe didn't end up mattering too much. Williams was supposed to be directly in front of the front receiver, but was also 5 yards out of position. That's what cost us.

 

[Mavric]

Biggest question I have is how often we ended up in single coverage with no safety help. Just watching the game in person and re-watching the first half in detail, I was really surprised that we almost never had any deep safety. I haven't gotten to re-watch the second half yet and we did better there so perhaps we changed coverages but what we did in the first half will not work long term. BYU had some decent WRs but we'll see a lot of guys a lot more athletic than they were as the season goes along and we had enough trouble staying with the lanky white boys.

 

[True2tRA]

I guess I don't understand the "If only we had someone better". That is so easy to say and we all wish we had all american's at every spot but we have to roll with who we have. I guess I'm also hurting for him too because I know what he's done and the work he has put in. Finally got his shot and he gets hurt. On top of that we have a bunch of grown men throwing him under the bus. I hope he doesn't read this board, and actually given who he is, I'd be shocked if he wasted his time to do so.

Gangwish played a pretty solid game really.

Here's the problem Coach Power T. Guys like you and me, we let this board know how much we like the kid and respect his game. So now , when he makes a mistake, its instantly going to be brought up. Freedom made his sack when Gangwish brought pressure from the other side and forced Taysom right into Freedoms gap. Not taking away from the kid, but that's how it happened. McMullen didn't do a heck of a lot did he? Not anymore than Gangwish did. I haven't heard anyone bring up McMullen much at all. Its unfortunate how once you let people know where they can target you, its the first place they'll go.

 

[GOAT]

I give Banker a lot of credit for making adjustments at halftime and putting us in a position to win -- unfortunately he threw it all away with that nonsense prevent garbage in the final minutes.

 

[BigRedBuster]

Here's another thing CoHusk. Since were singling out singular actions on a single play. How about if TA doesn't throw like an idiot on that B. Reilly seem route? Lead the guy, we score, and we don't have to worry about a Hail Mary beating us. In that case, BYU has to complete a hail mary and a 2pt conv.

Somehow that pass was probably Gangwish's fault too.

TA didn't throw like an idiot on that play. It was a good pass. Just could have been a little better.

 

[desertshox]

Biggest question I have is how often we ended up in single coverage with no safety help. Just watching the game in person and re-watching the first half in detail, I was really surprised that we almost never had any deep safety. I haven't gotten to re-watch the second half yet and we did better there so perhaps we changed coverages but what we did in the first half will not work long term. BYU had some decent WRs but we'll see a lot of guys a lot more athletic than they were as the season goes along and we had enough trouble staying with the lanky white boys.

his scheme puts the corners on a island where they dont have that help over the top.

and in that regard, riley's best hire for the defense might have been who he hired for wr coach.

 

[Saunders]

What I didn't get was having the boundary guy play press, and the open field corner play so far off the receivers. They threw the the non boundary side far more often. Hill isn't great at reading coverages, and IMO, we would have been better served in playing press on both WR's more often as they weren't fast, just big.

 

[Mavric]

Biggest question I have is how often we ended up in single coverage with no safety help. Just watching the game in person and re-watching the first half in detail, I was really surprised that we almost never had any deep safety. I haven't gotten to re-watch the second half yet and we did better there so perhaps we changed coverages but what we did in the first half will not work long term. BYU had some decent WRs but we'll see a lot of guys a lot more athletic than they were as the season goes along and we had enough trouble staying with the lanky white boys.

his scheme puts the corners on a island where they dont have that help over the top.

and in that regard, riley's best hire for the defense might have been who he hired for wr coach.

But it wasn't just the corners. Even the slot guys were singled up most of the time. When I think quarters coverage, I think the safeties have the deep middle half (one quarter each). But it seems like they would run up to cover a short receiver as the Nickel guys were trying to cover a slot deep.

And that was another problem - trying to cover a slot receiver with a defender lined up as an OLB. Both Cockrell and Gifford gave up easy completions because they were lined up so far inside the slot at the snap. They have no chance to cover a quick out from there.

 

[Mavric]

I guess I don't understand the "If only we had someone better". That is so easy to say and we all wish we had all american's at every spot but we have to roll with who we have. I guess I'm also hurting for him too because I know what he's done and the work he has put in. Finally got his shot and he gets hurt. On top of that we have a bunch of grown men throwing him under the bus. I hope he doesn't read this board, and actually given who he is, I'd be shocked if he wasted his time to do so.

Gangwish played a pretty solid game really.

Here's the problem Coach Power T. Guys like you and me, we let this board know how much we like the kid and respect his game. So now , when he makes a mistake, its instantly going to be brought up. Freedom made his sack when Gangwish brought pressure from the other side and forced Taysom right into Freedoms gap. Not taking away from the kid, but that's how it happened. McMullen didn't do a heck of a lot did he? Not anymore than Gangwish did. I haven't heard anyone bring up McMullen much at all. Its unfortunate how once you let people know where they can target you, its the first place they'll go.

Agree that we didn't get a lot from any of them (Gangwish, Freedom or McMullen). Actually, it's kind of interesting how similar they were on Saturday - they all had one solo tackle, one assist and one sack.

I don't know what all conversation has gone on lately but I think it's possible that Gangwish is being mentioned more now because of all the conversations about him previously. No one was really making an argument for McMullen earlier.

 

[zoogs]

When I think quarters coverage, I think four deep zones. Are corners "on an island" if they are playing zone, rather than man? You would certainly not expect to have safety help "over the top" -- a zone over the top of another deep zone?

 

[teachercd]

I guess I don't understand the "If only we had someone better". That is so easy to say and we all wish we had all american's at every spot but we have to roll with who we have. I guess I'm also hurting for him too because I know what he's done and the work he has put in. Finally got his shot and he gets hurt. On top of that we have a bunch of grown men throwing him under the bus. I hope he doesn't read this board, and actually given who he is, I'd be shocked if he wasted his time to do so.

Gangwish played a pretty solid game really.

Here's the problem Coach Power T. Guys like you and me, we let this board know how much we like the kid and respect his game. So now , when he makes a mistake, its instantly going to be brought up. Freedom made his sack when Gangwish brought pressure from the other side and forced Taysom right into Freedoms gap. Not taking away from the kid, but that's how it happened. McMullen didn't do a heck of a lot did he? Not anymore than Gangwish did. I haven't heard anyone bring up McMullen much at all. Its unfortunate how once you let people know where they can target you, its the first place they'll go.

Agree that we didn't get a lot from any of them (Gangwish, Freedom or McMullen). Actually, it's kind of interesting how similar they were on Saturday - they all had one solo tackle, one assist and one sack.

I don't know what all conversation has gone on lately but I think it's possible that Gangwish is being mentioned more now because of all the conversations about him previously. No one was really making an argument for McMullen earlier.

Yep!

 

[ColoradoHusk]

I guess I don't understand the "If only we had someone better". That is so easy to say and we all wish we had all american's at every spot but we have to roll with who we have. I guess I'm also hurting for him too because I know what he's done and the work he has put in. Finally got his shot and he gets hurt. On top of that we have a bunch of grown men throwing him under the bus. I hope he doesn't read this board, and actually given who he is, I'd be shocked if he wasted his time to do so.

Gangwish played a pretty solid game really.

Here's the problem Coach Power T. Guys like you and me, we let this board know how much we like the kid and respect his game. So now , when he makes a mistake, its instantly going to be brought up. Freedom made his sack when Gangwish brought pressure from the other side and forced Taysom right into Freedoms gap. Not taking away from the kid, but that's how it happened. McMullen didn't do a heck of a lot did he? Not anymore than Gangwish did. I haven't heard anyone bring up McMullen much at all. Its unfortunate how once you let people know where they can target you, its the first place they'll go.

Agree that we didn't get a lot from any of them (Gangwish, Freedom or McMullen). Actually, it's kind of interesting how similar they were on Saturday - they all had one solo tackle, one assist and one sack.

I don't know what all conversation has gone on lately but I think it's possible that Gangwish is being mentioned more now because of all the conversations about him previously. No one was really making an argument for McMullen earlier.

This is the last I will talk about Gangwish. I just don't think he is "good enough" to be a difference maker as the Rush End. McMullen may not be "good enough" either (I don't like how he is now 310 lbs). All summer, I commented on how I think the Rush Ends will struggle, and I got a lot of flak for that comment. People said that RG will be easy to replace, because he didn't play 100% all the time and he missed games due to injury. To be fair, Gangwish didn't ask for all the attention he got from the media. He is a "feel good" story, about hard-work, lifting, and perseverance.

I am listening to Jay Foreman's segment on Sharp and Benning right now. I am sure Foreman knows a LOT more about football than I do. Foreman likes Cover 4. He said when the D brings pressure, they have to be in-tune to what kind of D is being played behind you. When the rushers loses their lanes, it breaks down the coverage, because the DB's just can't cover that long. With RG, the opposing offenses had to gameplan for him. The offense does't have to do that. Foreman also brings up the fact that Gangwish can't do that spin move on the Hail Mary play. They should have 2 10-techniques and a zero-technique, to keep the QB hemmed in the pocket. Gangwish's spin move allowed the QB to roll out, and the WR to come all the way across the field for the catch. These are quotes from Foreman that I am paraphrasing.

One thing that is concerning with me about Banker's D, is that he isn't reinforcing technique. Yes, it's easier, but the guys have to maintain their technique.

 

[Mavric]

When I think quarters coverage, I think four deep zones. Are corners "on an island" if they are playing zone, rather than man? You would certainly not expect to have safety help "over the top" -- a zone over the top of another deep zone?

As I would see it - and this isn't necessarily how he runs it - the corners would not have help over the top, though it's possible that the safety on their side could be in the area to help depending on what else is going on. But I'm not talking about the outside guys, more the inside guys.

This is the play it was most obvious. After we had them pinned on the one yard line they hit a quick out to get off their goal line (more on that later). Here is the formation on the next play:

To me, we are already putting ourselves in a hole in how we're lining up because anything quick and to the outside we're outnumbered - the OLB is too far away to get to anything quick. But as to this discussion, the corner would have the deep outside guy and the safety (Williams) would have the next guy inside who goes deep as they would be in his quarter.

But that's not what happens. Williams jumps the shorter crossing route and we end up with both safeties covering the same guy and no help over the top for Cockrell who gets torched. (Sorry for the blurry pic)

Now, I don't know what the play call was. It's possible that Williams just screwed up his assignment. But if it's a true deep quarters coverage, it would be really odd for him to be that far out of his area, especially when the play started with trips to his side. Usually if you're overloaded to one side, you would squeeze your zones toward the overloaded side.

 

[ColoradoHusk]

Mavric, that play you show, one of the radio shows yesterday commented that Cockerell misplayed his receiver and he wasn't expecting him to go deep. Basically, it was a colossal screw-up by Cockerell.

 

[Mavric]

And if you put that play together with the previous play, it seems to me that we may be calling it a quarters coverage but it's more of a match-up man. In the play above, the three DBs on the trips side all lock onto a man and run with them. That was the same thing on the play before.

On this play, Cockrell lined up as basically an OLB and took several steps forward at the snap, looking as if he was keying the RB. And you can see on the replay from behind the defense that Williams - lined up at safety - started sprinting forward at the snap in an attempt to cover the slot. However, neither player was anywhere close to the slot and it was an easy catch on the quick out for a big gain.

But it definitely looked like we were running a match-up man defense - the corner on the wide out, Cockrell on the RB and Williams on the slot. But we aren't making it very easy on ourselves.