Will There Be a 2020 Football Season?

[JJ Husker]

Looks like lots of tangent thread material abounds.

 

[kansas45]

Looks like lots of tangent thread material abounds.

Yes and no. Yes it is a tangent in that I am not too bad at when I get an ad hom floated in my direction and responding with a better ad hom remark or an ad hom that is cryptic that causes the reader to have to look up certain information to truly comprehend the opposing ad hom. 

As per no, there is the notion that it did play nicely into the use of the masks that will be required. If anyone watched Reece Davis' College Football Live that aired recently, you will notice that many student-athletes were wearing masks while working out. This, in my view, could be a factor that will limit exercise efficiency and oxygen delivery as oxygen is utilized for energy in the human body. I do wonder what the oxygen saturation levels will be for student-athletes having to work out with masks and wonder how this will affect overall performance. 

I know this type of thinking is considered incoherent by those whose sole existence is based on "foo-ball" and advanced reading of comic books and nothing much more. I am hopeful that when they did attend college that they application was not a coloring book and were considered an honors student if they stayed in the lines on greater than 50% of the task. I believe a fan board posting should go beyond 5 words such as "they played good..foo-ball...good" as if the Neanderthals are ruling the earth and we are drinking from the fountain of their infinite wisdom and bathing in the waters of their brilliance. 

 

[Notre Dame Joe]

Isn't the fact that a state has to consider reopening a closed hospital an indication of a problem? They already spent $4.1 million revamping it to prepare for it to be used. That right there suggests they know that existing hospitals will be overrun.

Even if the hospital remained closed, the argument that it's proof of anything is fundamentally flawed. 

It's a simple proposition; if PHX was running short of hospital capacity then they would reopen the large empty one in the middle of the city.  Back in the spring that was a realistic possibility.  But now we can't even web search recent news debating it. 

Another thing "need to be hospitalized" is a variable.  I know a Canadian man who suffered pretty badly with Covid but they told him to remain in his basement and consult daily with medical staff on the phone.  I'm pretty sure some people are being admitted for less. 

 

[Notre Dame Joe]

That's an unreasonable standard that nobody is suggesting.  No intelligent person would assert that there must be 0% risk of harm before an activity can be resumed.  That's just plain stupid.

Determining the degree of risk certain activities pose, and weighing that against possible gain is not unique to this pandemic.  This is just a different variable.

Glad you did, helps to organize my thoughts. I am a list-type of guy (except grocery lists, I don't do that because I like to drive my wife insane). 

6. It's simple. We accept that in the game of football, injuries occur such as concussion and ACL tears; this is a part of the game that we accept as "the risk element." However, no one signed up for playing while a contagious disease is roaming around that no one knows the long-term consequences of and that has essentially shut down a large part of the USA economy. A knee injury has not shut down an economy. When did football become a more essential aspect than that of a someone getting a haircut? 

They play football during the flu season and the flu causes more fatalities than we appreciated. Both viruses pose a risk to a player's life that is so low.  The underlying health conditions listed above, the ones that would put a youth into the vulnerable category, sound like conditions that would already exclude him from college football. Furthermore the schools know their medical history and can exclude any vulnerable players. 

Simply put, the fear that more players will die from covid if there is a football season is not supported by logic and evidence.  The chance of serious physical injury from the virus is negligible compared to the dangerous game of football. 

 

[JJ Husker]

Yes and no. Yes it is a tangent in that I am not too bad at when I get an ad hom floated in my direction and responding with a better ad hom remark or an ad hom that is cryptic that causes the reader to have to look up certain information to truly comprehend the opposing ad hom. 

As per no, there is the notion that it did play nicely into the use of the masks that will be required. If anyone watched Reece Davis' College Football Live that aired recently, you will notice that many student-athletes were wearing masks while working out. This, in my view, could be a factor that will limit exercise efficiency and oxygen delivery as oxygen is utilized for energy in the human body. I do wonder what the oxygen saturation levels will be for student-athletes having to work out with masks and wonder how this will affect overall performance. 

I know this type of thinking is considered incoherent by those whose sole existence is based on "foo-ball" and advanced reading of comic books and nothing much more. I am hopeful that when they did attend college that they application was not a coloring book and were considered an honors student if they stayed in the lines on greater than 50% of the task. I believe a fan board posting should go beyond 5 words such as "they played good..foo-ball...good" as if the Neanderthals are ruling the earth and we are drinking from the fountain of their infinite wisdom and bathing in the waters of their brilliance. 

You talk a lot.

 

[kansas45]

They play football during the flu season and the flu causes more fatalities than we appreciated. Both viruses pose a risk to a player's life that is so low.  The underlying health conditions listed above, the ones that would put a youth into the vulnerable category, sound like conditions that would already exclude him from college football. Furthermore the schools know their medical history and can exclude any vulnerable players. 

Simply put, the fear that more players will die from covid if there is a football season is not supported by logic and evidence.  The chance of serious physical injury from the virus is negligible compared to the dangerous game of footba

Ok, then why did this happen today?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29520125/michigan-state-pauses-workouts-staff-member-tests-positive-covid-19

If they know their athletes conditions, why even "pause" the workouts? Where is the logic in that? I mean, no one is going to die. Can you explain this to me? I mean, it is no different from the flu. 

But let's look at these conditions. 

·       Serious heart conditions, such as heart failure, coronary artery disease, or cardiomyopathies.

·       Sickle cell disease.

·       Type 2 diabetes mellitus.

These conditions do NOT prevent you from playing athletics. A heart condition such as hypertrophic obstructive cardiomyopathy can happen and is the leading cause of cardiac events in athletes. Sickle cell disease does not prevent an athlete from performing. The National Athletic Trainers Association has guidelines for this. 

And where is your evidence that there is no long term effects of covid? Oh that's right. It is not available because we simply do not know. 

I think you should be the chosen as one of the commissioners of a conference to tell us this great information and tell us "nothing to worry about, play on as if nothing is going on; we will kickoff the season with full crowds and a full schedule." Man, those other conferences that cancelled their seasons are sure looking foolish right now. 

 

[kansas45]

You talk a lot.

 No. I write a lot. I do not talk that much unless I am in my job performing a specific task that requires it. Mostly, my job is one that requires writing and deep contemplated thought with explanations. 

 

[JJ Husker]

 No. I write a lot. I do not talk that much unless I am in my job performing a specific task that requires it. Mostly, my job is one that requires writing and deep contemplated thought with explanations. 

Good point. You do write, or more specifically type, a lot. Usually quite a bit more than seems necessary.

 

[Branno]

It's a simple proposition; if PHX was running short of hospital capacity then they would reopen the large empty one in the middle of the city.  Back in the spring that was a realistic possibility.  But now we can't even web search recent news debating it. 

Another thing "need to be hospitalized" is a variable.  I know a Canadian man who suffered pretty badly with Covid but they told him to remain in his basement and consult daily with medical staff on the phone.  I'm pretty sure some people are being admitted for less. 

You have no idea what you’re talking about. Opening a hospital isn’t something you can just do at the drop of a hat. 
 

There are news reports I’ve already linked to in this thread that patients are being sent out of the state due to occupancy issues. 

 

[Branno]

They play football during the flu season and the flu causes more fatalities than we appreciated. Both viruses pose a risk to a player's life that is so low.  The underlying health conditions listed above, the ones that would put a youth into the vulnerable category, sound like conditions that would already exclude him from college football. Furthermore the schools know their medical history and can exclude any vulnerable players. 

Simply put, the fear that more players will die from covid if there is a football season is not supported by logic and evidence.  The chance of serious physical injury from the virus is negligible compared to the dangerous game of football. 

Repeat after me: 

Covid

19

is

not

the

flu

and

our

response

to

it

shouldn’t

mirror

our

response

to

the

seasonal

flu. 

 

[teachercd]

You have no idea what you’re talking about. Opening a hospital isn’t something you can just do at the drop of a hat. 
 

There are news reports I’ve already linked to in this thread that patients are being sent out of the state due to occupancy issues. 

How long is a "drop of a hat"?

Because can't the military open one in like 24 hours?

 

[kansas45]

Good point. You do write, or more specifically type, a lot. Usually quite a bit more than seems necessary.

I will agree with that. Guilty as charged. 

 

[Branno]

How long is a "drop of a hat"?

Because can't the military open one in like 24 hours?

That's a really good question, and you happened to ask an expert! I served as a 68D20 (Operating Room Sergeant) in the US Army for 12 years. A good portion of that was as part of a CSH (Combat Support Hospital) in the reserves, a unit that would be called upon to create a field hospital in the event of an emergency.

It takes 3 days to build a CSH. The ER has 24 hours to open, the OR/ICU/LAB/PHARM need to be open within 48 with the rest of the hospital fully online within 72 hours. This includes stringing out the layout of the hospital, emptying containers, construction of the hospital using ISO containers and temper tents, setting up power and water, etc. 

This takes roughly 200-300 highly trained soldiers to accomplish, after months of training and preparation. These hospitals come full staffed, a staff that has years of experience working with each other.

What does this have to do with staffing an existing hospital? Absolutely nothing.

Right now, this closed hospital has no staff. No chief of medicine. No head nurses. No doctors. No IT staff. No janitors. 

Are we even sure that there are enough medical professionals to staff the hospital if it was opened?

 

[Jason Sitoke]

 No. I write a lot. I do not talk that much unless I am in my job performing a specific task that requires it. Mostly, my job is one that requires writing and deep contemplated thought with explanations. 

Yeah.  You're like a poet.  If a poet meant the opposite of its actual definition.

 

[Mavric]

That's a bad argument to make and you know it. In fact,  it's the definition of the logical fallacy of equivocation.

There are things we can't avoid in football, for example contact, without it becoming soccer. You just accept the risk and do whatever you can to mitigate it. 

But, you can avoid COVID-19 related issues. To suggest we can't, is nonsense.

Nope.  Just one you can't argue against so you have to resort to being dismissive and making stuff up.

If a player follows social distancing guidelines, wears masks, takes online classes, and DOES NOT PLAY FOOTBALL they are significantly less likely to contract COVID-19. I don't understand how this concept is so hard to understand.

It's hard to understand because at best it's a huge assumption and at worst it's completely false.