The Environment

Archy1221 said:
The question is to what extent is that one variable changing the dynamic of a constantly evolving climate.   It’s hardly a strain to imagine other variable are in play that affect the climate.
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Of course there are other things affecting climate. 
 

I don’t have a problem admitting Humans play a part and if we can limit that to being much less, we should. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
It's hardly a strain to imagine that the addition of 2 trillion tons of carbon to the atmosphere since the beginning of the industrial revolution would affect the atmosphere and climate. But you know what else emits a lot of CO2? Volcanoes! And they're natural! Just one volcano -- Krakatoa -- put so much debris in the atmosphere in 1883 it actually created a global winter that lasted two years! And that's winter which means cooling, not heating. 

But yeah, human-generated carbon still outweighs volcanoes 60:1, and the Earth has been steadily heating up much as climatologists have projected for years, although unfortunately even faster than the models suggested just a decade ago. 

Humans evil? That's a value judgement. Simple fact is that humans are the dominant species on earth, consume a vast amount of natural resources (increasingly so as standards of living rise), and have grown from 1.6 billion to 8 billion in population since that Industrial Revolution. It takes a lot of contortion to pretend we aren't massively affecting the global ecosystem. Fossil fuels bad? Another value judgement, but in terms of the economic, political, and environmental consequences of our petroleum dependence, it makes perfect nonpartisan sense to pursue alternatives. I'm happy to thank fossil fuels for all they've provided, and welcome their participation in a lesser role. 

You do know that when you say "I think not" the you in question is Archy1221, right? And that other folks know a lot more than you do because that's their job? 
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Thank you, I have said this soooo many times.

We have so many non-teachers that post about education.  How they know better and more than the teachers here me and @funhusker and I forget who else. 

So next time the non-teachers think they know more and know better, please remember that you don't.  

With that said, in game threads we are all still allowed to rip on the coaches for not knowing what the f#&% they are doing.

 
Archy1221 said:
So according to your answer, this years Ocean heating will continue on? Right? The anomaly of this year will happen again next year and the next and the next right.  Because as you linked to, oceans are capturing this heat and it won’t be getting better anytime in the near future.  World Carbon outputs continue to get higher each year.  
 

Why the sudden anomaly this year?  Should be similar to any other temp rise if it’s carbon based warming. 
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A variety of things. Could be a feedback loop undiscovered, a runaway problem slowly accelerating in the background until a breaking point has now been reached. Ecological and environmental collapse doesn't happen linearly. A collapse in one system can lead to a rapid collapse in another that depends on it, a chain reaction with terrible consequences. Such feedback loops, especially those regarding climate, happens and become understood. 

Whatever is happening in Ocean temperatures right now should be extremely alarming. This is so far beyond what should be happening, even for the most doom and gloom climate models, that this is on the verge of ecologic catastrophe. 

Archy1221 said:
You throwing out insults doesn’t answer the question to a statement you were clear on making.   
 

What is his view on solar panels?  Is he for them or against them or agnostic to their use?  Your posts read like you know, so tell us instead of insulting people.  
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I mean, it was in his own tweet. His claim was that solar panels are dirty, that scientists are lying about them, and he's doing so to speak to a crowd that he wants to believe - falsely - that climate change isn't as bad as claimed and we can just work to combat it. I pointed out that he KNOWS that solar PV production is being moved to the United States at a record pace and that he KNOWS that even in the worst case scenario that the "carbon debt" in the production of solar panels is quickly "paid" multiple times over during their service life. So I apologize if I insulted you, but you seem to be willingly ignoring what he's doing. 

I get you want to make sense of the world and in doing so, you want to believe that things are fine - climate is ever changing after all - and that human behavior doesn't cause climate change. But this isn't exactly a debate in science right now. Agreement is extremely widespread. Get with the rest of the world.

 
Archy1221 said:
No one here is disputing this so what’s your point with this?
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Followed by you blaming the Earth's mantle. 

I knew you would contort yourself, but dude......

Archy1221 said:
What if the Earth is going through one of these natural cycles that scientist know exist? 
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Hey, let's ask the scientists!

(Extra points if you can name the variable that humans might possibly control) 

 
Archy1221 said:
Yes.  So now that the camels back is broken and carbon in the atmosphere will not be declining anytime soon, this is the new normal for ocean temps now, right? 
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The issue isn’t so much what is happening right now in the world. Of course there are other factors affecting the right now. Some/many can be attributable to just normal variance but that doesn’t negate the ongoing and cumulative affects of mankind created change. Climate change understandingly will get talked about more when temperatures are soaring. That doesn’t mean every single hot day or higher than normal ocean temp is 100% responsible for the anomaly.

There are some things that data shows it is having an influence though. Polar ice caps and glaciers disappearing. Global all time high temps being exceeded. And yes ocean temps trending upwards. It’s not just now today but trends that have been observed and documented.

It really gets old seeing you accept that carbon emissions are causing “”some” change but then in the same breath saying all these things we’re experiencing are just normal variance. Of course some of it is but the evidence is overwhelming that the humans on this planet aren’t helping and are in fact making it worse. Wouldn’t you agree that the sooner we as a species get ahead of this the better? It will be way too late if we wait until the ice caps are gone, the oceans too hot consistently and the ocean salinity and currents are forever impacted. Unless all you’re concerned about is your remaining living years, cuz yeah, it  won’t get super ugly in the next 20-30 years but it could easily surpass the point of no return in that time.

 
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CO2 Coalition....lol

https://www.eenews.net/articles/trump-adviser-created-group-to-defend-co2/

Fill up that gas-guzzling truck — because global bursts of carbon dioxide will benefit society, feed the poor and help future generations thrive.

Those photos of bleached coral, the disappearing island nations and images of glaciers tumbling into the ocean are "mostly myths designed to terrify people into accepting harmful policies that allegedly ‘save the planet.’"

Those are some of the claims promoted by the CO2 Coalition, a nonprofit founded in 2015 by the White House official who’s overseeing the administration’s "adversarial" review of climate science. The group’s assertions are disputed by a vast majority of climate researchers. But in the eyes of CO2 Coalition members, it’s the world’s leading scientists who are wrong.
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The CO2 Coalition, established by William Happer, a senior director with the White House National Security Council, has received more than $1 million from energy executives and conservative foundations that fight regulations since it was founded four years ago. The group is stacked with researchers who cast doubt on climate science. Other members have spent years fighting regulations that would reduce fossil fuel consumption
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Dr. Strangelove said:
I mean, it was in his own tweet. His claim was that solar panels are dirty, that scientists are lying about them
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The claim was they cause thrice the amount of carbon than what scientists claim they cause and possibly a slight bit more than natural gas.   He doesn’t claim they shouldn’t be used.   His gripe is the falsified data.  
 

Yet you made assumptions otherwise about him and the article and have no understanding about his feelings towards the usage of solar panels. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Archy1221 said:
No one here is disputing this so what’s your point with this?
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Followed by you blaming the Earth's mantle. 

I knew you would contort yourself, but dude
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Ummm, well you are smart enough to understand that I responded to humans affecting ecosystems and building cities where nature once stood is affecting ecosystems, but those cities themselves are not responsible for climate changes.   I mean, the climate cult even agrees as they have no problem with human advancement, they just don’t want it done with fossil fuels.   
 

Affecting an ecosystem and being responsible for causing widespread climate are not really the same thing.  You can do the first and not do the second.  I know You would agree here.  
 

With that said, it made your next point ridiculous as you try and assert I blame humans for climate change and then immediately blame Earths mantle for ocean temp increases.  I knew you would try and gaslight but dude. 

Guy Chamberlin said:
Hey, let's ask the scientists
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People have and papers have been written.  The climate cult says nahahahahahahahahah and blows it off.   Yet they can’t account for this rapid rise in ocean temp with carbon blaming alone. 

 
Dr. Strangelove said:
It kills me that you post a scientist that says something you like, but that you ignore the OVERWHELMING voices that disagree with you. Absolutely hilarious. 
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It kills me that post scientist that says something you like, but that you ignore the voices that disagree with you.  That is hilarious.  I mean, your overwhelming consensus cult was saying the Earth was going into another ice age not more than 50 years ago.   

 
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