The Environment

teachercd said:
Best part of that article was the picture of the bros playing volleyball!
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How about this gem from article.   Why didn’t these a$$h@!es tell me to stop using my gas stove 5 years ago so we didn’t hit defcon 10 on this scary place.  

And why are we holding in-person climate change meetings.  Isn’t zoom a thing now!  Or did these people plant a tree before their private jet flight and do the carbon neutral thingy?

“Francis said on a 1-to-10 scale of how bad the situation is, she gives what’s happening now “a 10, but soon we’ll need a new scale because what’s a 10 today will be a five in the future unless society can stop the buildup of heat-trapping gases.”

 
Archy1221 said:
How about this gem from article.   Why didn’t these a$$h@!es tell me to stop using my gas stove 5 years ago so we didn’t hit defcon 10 on this scary place.  

And why are we holding in-person climate change meetings.  Isn’t zoom a thing now!  Or did these people plant a tree before their private jet flight and do the carbon neutral thingy?

“Francis said on a 1-to-10 scale of how bad the situation is, she gives what’s happening now “a 10, but soon we’ll need a new scale because what’s a 10 today will be a five in the future unless society can stop the buildup of heat-trapping gases.”
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I mean that is a super sciency scale right there...the old 1-10!

And, Francis doesn't say if 10 is the worst or best?  

You always have to say "Scale 1-10, 10 being the _________"

You learn that on your first day at Pearl Clutching U.

 
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Scarlet said:
I don't expect the bros who struggle with concepts like rates, ratios, and proportions to understand weather vs climate but I'll post this for people who actually can understand rudimentary statistics and trends

https://apnews.com/article/hot-climate-change-records-oceans-0af09f155051b25d245a0fd28fe23af6

For the ninth straight month, Earth has obliterated global heat records — with February, the winter as a whole and the world’s oceans setting new high-temperature marks
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The ocean temperature in the North Atlantic has set a record high every day in 2024. And not by small margins.

Archy1221 said:
I am gonna take your advice.  Everyone should my man including you.  We’ve apparently passed the point of no return in this big scary place according you what you said earlier.   There is no point in trying to change anything.  
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I never said that. What I said was that the planet warming has far surpassed worse case scenarios, predictions made by scientists years ago. No scientific projections predicted ocean temperatures where they are today - hence the meaning of passing even the worst scenarios because that's true.

teachercd said:
Wow, I was kidding about being scared of everything but you seem serious.  "The world is a big scary place"
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I say that because reactionary politics of people on the right are in large part because of paranoia and fear. 

Archy1221 and other right wingers deny climate change because denying reality is comforting to them. Because the truth scares them, and they'd have to reconcile support for destructive politics. 

 
Dr. Strangelove said:
The ocean temperature in the North Atlantic has set a record high every day in 2024. And not by small margins.

I never said that. What I said was that the planet warming has far surpassed worse case scenarios, predictions made by scientists years ago. No scientific projections predicted ocean temperatures where they are today - hence the meaning of passing even the worst scenarios because that's true.

I say that because reactionary politics of people on the right are in large part because of paranoia and fear. 

Archy1221 and other right wingers deny climate change because denying reality is comforting to them. Because the truth scares them, and they'd have to reconcile support for destructive politics. 
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I mean, I like most of your posts but you are wrong.  No one is "denying climate change" we all know the climate will change (it has to) and that the sun will one day die.  We are denying living in fear over it.  You are living in fear over it.

Look at it like this (and before the "That is not a good metaphor" crowd comes in, just know that I don't know what a metaphor or analogy is so it doesn't matter what you say)

You drive, right?  You are super likely to get into a bad or even fatal accident driving, statistically speaking.   We all know this, for the most part the only thing we do about is wear a seatbelt.  We still speed, we still cut people off, we don't always signal, we roll through stops, we do all we can to make it through that yellow light, we check out texts.  Even though WE KNOW something bad could happen.

We are not "Car Accident Deniers" we are normal people that don't live in constant fear.  

 
Dr. Strangelove said:
I never said that. What I said was that the planet warming has far surpassed worse case scenarios, predictions made by scientists years ago. No scientific projections predicted ocean temperatures where they are today - hence the meaning of passing even the worst scenarios because that's true.
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And what has this “worst case scenario” done to us?  It’s so bad, no one could have predicted it, yet here we are all nice and tidy.  Were we supposed to be heading to super boats with our tickets like in the movie 2012. 
 

Dr. Strangelove said:
Archy1221 and other right wingers deny climate change because denying reality is comforting to them. Because the truth scares them, and they'd have to reconcile support for destructive politics. 
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Now here is where you are wrong again.  I don’t deny climate change and never have.   What you don’t seem to know is the Earths climate has changed for billions of years.  You may also not understand that humans have not been on the planet for billions of years.  
 

Funny story but for a long long long long time the Earth didn’t even have glaciers.   Then interestingly enough, the glaciers we do have we much much much larger than present day.  Not sure how they melted so much when cars aren’t around though :dunno   Maybe it was the Bear farts.  

 
Archy1221 said:
Now here is where you are wrong again.  I don’t deny climate change and never have.   What you don’t seem to know is the Earths climate has changed for billions of years.  You may also not understand that humans have not been on the planet for billions of years.  
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There's denying it exists, which way too many people do in the first place, and then there's different flavors of denying that it is a problem for us. I think you're well aware of what has historically happened to dominant life forms when the earth's climate changed too much.

Our existence is based in part off of the stability of the climate. Our flourishing and comfort and safety are based in part off of the stability of the climate even moreso. Our bodies, buildings, grids, cities, and systems of social order are all predicated on the predictability and regularity of the last several thousand years of stable ice age and are fundamentally ill-equipped to withstand the results of severe changes to those parameters.

Even if we've had nothing to do with the way the climate has been changing, it's pretty imperative for life as we know it to figure out ways we can engineer against it.

 
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Lorewarn said:
Even if we've had nothing to do with the way the climate has been changing, it's pretty imperative for life as we know it to figure out ways we can engineer against it.
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This is very good, and common sense. The problem are the "envirobros" chicken littles (as @teachercd says) that scream for higher taxes and forced conformity but really have no idea what will work to mitigate the issue.

 
DevoHusker said:
This is very good, and common sense. The problem are the "envirobros" chicken littles (as @teachercd says) that scream for higher taxes and forced conformity but really have no idea what will work to mitigate the issue.
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The thing is, if you are an envirobro and you do ANYTHING at all that hurts the environment, than what you say doesn't matter and you are a phony.  Period.

For instance, I hate guns and firemen.  I will NEVER own a gun or a bullet, I will never go to a gun store or gun show, ever ever...And I will never donate to anything fireman related and I would never use their "help"

But envirbros, even here on this site, still hurt the environment every single day.  So they really don't care they just love the juice that comes with the talk.  

 
Archy1221 said:
And what has this “worst case scenario” done to us?  It’s so bad, no one could have predicted it, yet here we are all nice and tidy.  Were we supposed to be heading to super boats with our tickets like in the movie 2012. 
 

Now here is where you are wrong again.  I don’t deny climate change and never have.   What you don’t seem to know is the Earths climate has changed for billions of years.  You may also not understand that humans have not been on the planet for billions of years.  
 

Funny story but for a long long long long time the Earth didn’t even have glaciers.   Then interestingly enough, the glaciers we do have we much much much larger than present day.  Not sure how they melted so much when cars aren’t around though :dunno   Maybe it was the Bear farts.  
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How do you know the Earth's climate has changed over billions of years? How do you know that the Earth didn't used to have glaciers? 

I mean, I knew that, too. I was a geology minor at UNL. Always found it fascinating. The Earth has been through its share of extremes long before humans came along, much less AOC.

The reason we know all this about the Earth is because scientists dedicated their lives to studying it. And it's those same scientists who know perfectly well about the Earth's violent past who are tracking the 100%* undeniable fact of global warming, glacial melt, climate change and severe weather increase. These f#&%ers are so smart they took that cold week in Omaha into account. When asked for a reason for this rapid of a change in this particular Earth window, some theorize that the trillions of tons of carbon thrown into the atmosphere since the industrial revolution could easily have that effect. Some point out that volcanoes do the same thing. But the smart ones point out that human industrialization can affect the Earth's climate just like historic eruptions do. One hardly excuses the other. 

It was the tree huggers at the Pentagon who identified climate change as the worst threat to global stability. Maybe you could take it up with them. In the meantime, under the cloak of socialism, the push to more efficient energy usage turns out to have a strong business innovation, jobs creation, and American intellectual property component. I guess horse manufacturers were threatened by the arrival of the automobile back in the day, but we survived, and somehow managed to live with a lot less horses#!t. 

* Mathematical probability, not racist. 

 
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DevoHusker said:
Lol...

Yeah, because all those chicken littles totally go by scientific method  :laughpound
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Climate change is real, yes? And we agree that it we'll be a problem or humanity long term, right? Clearly the free market doesn't work to mitigate the issue, so the next logical step would be legislation and consumption tax, no?

Are you a smoker? Do you have a problem with tobacco taxes? Do you think we should still be using asbestos, lead paint, CFLs, leaded gasoline, remove catalytic converters from cars, allow companies to leach toxins into the water like hexavalent chromium, maybe it's ok if your near by feed lot drains their s#!t pond into the local tributaries?

 
ZRod said:
Climate change is real, yes? And we agree that it we'll be a problem or humanity long term, right? Clearly the free market doesn't work to mitigate the issue, so the next logical step would be legislation and consumption tax, no?

Are you a smoker? Do you have a problem with tobacco taxes? Do you think we should still be using asbestos, lead paint, CFLs, leaded gasoline, remove catalytic converters from cars, allow companies to leach toxins into the water like hexavalent chromium, maybe it's ok if your near by feed lot drains their s#!t pond into the local tributaries?
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I have a problem with all taxes, as we all do.  But I don't think that is your point.

Do you do ANYTHING at all that hurts the environment, anything?  

I do, my car, my house, some of the stuff I burn in my fire pit.  What about you?

 
ZRod said:
Climate change is real, yes? And we agree that it we'll be a problem or humanity long term, right? Clearly the free market doesn't work to mitigate the issue, so the next logical step would be legislation and consumption tax, no?

Are you a smoker? Do you have a problem with tobacco taxes? Do you think we should still be using asbestos, lead paint, CFLs, leaded gasoline, remove catalytic converters from cars, allow companies to leach toxins into the water like hexavalent chromium, maybe it's ok if your near by feed lot drains their s#!t pond into the local tributaries?
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Environmental change is real. Yes.

It may or may not be a problem for humanity, we truly do not know.

Why doesn't the free market mitigate the problem? Do you have sources for that? And, if human consumption is the driving factor, what is anyone doing about China, India and Russia...whose negative output dwarfs the US and Eu?

No, I don't believe that "usage" or "consumption" taxes or fair or realistic. Tell that to the climate warriors that jet set around the globe to tell me that my 2008 F150 is the major contributing factor. gtfoh

Nope, not a smoker. My dad is/was and still says he should have a seat in Devaney in perpetuity cause "smoker's taxes" paid for it.

As to the rest, we learned as we go...and some things are definitive and some are supposition.

 
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