Biden's Infrastructure Proposal

BigRedBuster said:
Building materials right now are so scarce and expensive that I'm not sure where this big infrastructure bill is going to get the materials needed to accomplish what is planned.
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Yes, I'm not to sure about govt becoming the  're-modeler' of choice either.  The idea of retrofitting houses and buildings at the scale they are talking about seems like a graft filled enterprise in waiting.    While I think most of the proposals are 'noble' and are meant to better the lives of us average Joes, I'm not sure how workable many are.  I think they threw in the kitchen sink so they could negotiate it away and still end up with the bulk of what they want.

Agree that fixing health care and immigration have got to be on the top of the list.  Time to address these long festering issues. 

Dr. Strangelove said:
The United States can become a leader in those energy sectors or it can let our competitors do so. But Green energy IS coming. Let's invest in it and keep those jobs here when possible.
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Yes, it is the wave and we need to get i front of it.  I don't care if you are liberal or conservative - we can't be the world's leader if we don't invest in it and this is where the whole world is trending.   Countries are like companies.  If they don't adapt and change, they will fall behind and 'go out of business'.  Think of the many publishing, music companies and retail outlets who produced & sold books and music were not ready for the digitization of media and are no longer in business.

 
Frott Scost said:
Those are the things you think are nonsense? The only thing in there that I dont really understand is the essential home care workers thing. The other stuff you pointed out are essential parts of a good infrastructure bill. More needs to be done than just patch up

some roads and bridges and call it good. The republicans had a chance to make this bill happen, Trump even said he wanted an infrastructure bill and they didnt get it done. Its their MO not to get things done.
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It should be in its own bill package.  So yes in my view it’s nonsense when speaking of a national infrastructure plan.  We disagree on this and that’s fine 

 
Here is a bit of a risk/benefit look

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/the-american-families-plan-is-biden-e2-80-99s-bet-that-he-can-remake-the-economy-without-any-negative-side-effects/ar-BB1g9D1R?ocid=uxbndlbing

The latest proposal in Biden’s economic agenda would spend another $1.8 trillion, mostly on education, child care, and family and medical leave programs, but that would be on top of $2.3 trillion in proposed infrastructure investment and the $1.9 trillion that Congress passed in March as an emergency response to the pandemic.

Here's what is in Biden's American Families Plan

The biggest concern is that the economy will overheat from so much stimulus, triggering rapid price increases that would make it difficult for middle-class families to afford goods and force policymakers to slow growth to contain inflation. Already there are pockets of concern, with used-car prices up nearly 10 percent and meat, including beef and pork chops, up almost 6 percent over the past year.

To pay for this new spending, Biden wants significant tax increases on the wealthy and corporations, but some economists and business leaders warn this has the potential to backfire. Higher taxes can stymie new investment in the private sector, curb enthusiasm for starting new businesses and even push existing U.S. companies to move overseas.

Separately, some economists worry that spending so much to strengthen the government safety net, especially along with increased unemployment aid, has the potential to dissuade some lower-income workers from working, especially those in lower-paying jobs that continue to dominate much of the service sector.

“The philosophy behind the Biden administration is everyone can have more. We can have the cake and eat it, too. There is no price to pay in terms of inflation, higher interest rates or slower growth,” said Sung Won Sohn, a professor of finance and economics at Loyola Marymount University and a former bank executive. “If they are wrong, the price tag will be pretty high.”
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Dr. Strangelove said:
I hope Green energy proposals stay in the bill. It doesn't matter what you're opinion is, that is the future. 

The United States can become a leader in those energy sectors or it can let our competitors do so. But Green energy IS coming. Let's invest in it and keep those jobs here when possible. 
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Yep.  The play is to promote the fact that China is poised to overtake the U.S. in alternative energy, not simply an ideology but intellectual property and patented technology that will make billions for private industry. The last administration was literally tilting at windmills. 

 
Archy1221 said:
This 
 

Build, preserve, and retrofit more than two million homes and commercial buildings, modernize our nation’s schools and child care facilities, and upgrade veterans’ hospitals and federal buildings. President Biden’s plan will create good jobs building, rehabilitating, and retrofitting affordable, accessible, energy efficient, and resilient housing, commercial buildings, schools, and child care facilities all over the country, while also vastly improving our nation’s federal facilities, especially those that serve veterans.

Solidify the infrastructure of our care economy by creating jobs and raising wages and benefits for essential home care workers. These workers – the majority of whom are women of color – have been underpaid and undervalued for too long. The President’s plan makes substantial investments in the infrastructure of our care economy, starting by creating new and better jobs for caregiving workers. His plan will provide home and community-based care for individuals who otherwise would need to wait as many as five years to get the services they badly need.

Revitalize manufacturing, secure U.S. supply chains, invest in R&D, and train Americans for the jobs of the future. President Biden’s plan will ensure that the best, diverse minds in America are put to work creating the innovations of the future while creating hundreds of thousands of quality jobs today. Our workers will build and make things in every part of America, and they will be trained for well-paying, middle-class jobs.

Create good-quality jobs that pay prevailing wages in safe and healthy workplaces while ensuring workers have a free and fair choice to organize, join a union, and bargain collectively with their employers. By ensuring that American taxpayers’ dollars benefit working families and their communities, and not multinational corporations or foreign governments, the plan will require that goods and materials are made in America and shipped on U.S.-flag, U.S.-crewed vessels. The plan also will ensure that Americans who have endured systemic discrimination and exclusion for generations finally have a fair shot at obtaining good paying jobs and being part of a union.
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You know perfectly well that had Donald Trump proposed the same thing (minus the last pro-union bit) Republicans would have hailed it as bold America-first leadership. 

 
jaws said:
I love the investment into infrastructure but part of me doesn't trust a lot of the companies that would be involved when it comes to Internet access. They have wasted federal money in the past and lied about expanded rollouts. I don't know how this will be any different for the large ISPs. 

As for Starlink, at first I was skeptical but this looks like the real deal. As they add capacity (satellite and ground links), this will really start to open up the possibilities for those with poor quality ISPs or where ISPs are unwilling to go. The speeds and latency I have seen from some review have been amazing. I have been stuck in remote locations in the past and had to rely on satellite internet to fix some network equipment. Working with 800ms-2000ms latency isn't fun. 

I have also been impressed with T-Mobile's home internet delivery (4g/5g). It has provided very usable service at a decent price for so of my friends in ISP dead spots. 

Starlink tracking map (there is a better one but I can't find it at the moment): 

https://starlinkradar.com/livemap.html
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Did you have any experience with Iridium? They were a really well-funded launch about 25 years ago, with their own satellite network, able to promise cell phone connection to virtually any nook or cranny on Earth. It was pricy, but not unlike other first adopter technologies.  My brother bought some stock in it, and we found out that satellite systems and personnel are really expensive to maintain while waiting for paying customers to step up. Out of business in just a few years. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Did you have any experience with Iridium? They were a really well-funded launch about 25 years ago, with their own satellite network, able to promise cell phone connection to virtually any nook or cranny on Earth. It was pricy, but not unlike other first adopter technologies.  My brother bought some stock in it, and we found out that satellite systems and personnel are really expensive to maintain while waiting for paying customers to step up. Out of business in just a few years. 
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I didn't have any experience with them.  I do however wonder what this will do with our space junk problem. 

As for the comment by @VectorVictor about copper networks, I ask why not use some of the infrastructure in place to deliver a better solution. I am all for fiber but there is a lot of copper in place already. https://www.cablelabs.com/technologies/docsis-4-0-technology

Now we just need to get rid of data caps. :)

 
BigRedBuster said:
You said you wanted the non-infrastructure stuff taken out and you listed this one.

This is part of infrastructure and it helps veterans.  So, my conclusion is valid.
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It’s not valid it’s stupid.   Put it in another bill.  Taking it out of infrastructure bill has no bearing on how people feel about veterans.  

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Did you have any experience with Iridium? They were a really well-funded launch about 25 years ago, with their own satellite network, able to promise cell phone connection to virtually any nook or cranny on Earth. It was pricy, but not unlike other first adopter technologies.  My brother bought some stock in it, and we found out that satellite systems and personnel are really expensive to maintain while waiting for paying customers to step up. Out of business in just a few years. 
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Iridium was good for satellite flares.

 
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