Confederate flags

Ulty

Ulty

New member
I see quite a few confederate flags from time to time. I live in a conservative district of southwestern Ohio, close to the Kentucky and Indiana borders. I see confederate flag emblems on cars, on license plate covers, draped in the windows of houses. Not too long ago I saw a young man (teens or early 20s) driving a beater of a car with a full sized confederate flag flying out the window, flagpole and all.

Now I see this article:

"The number of Tennesseans with Confederate battle flag license plates has reached its highest point in a decade."

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/tennessee/articles/2018-07-19/more-confederate-license-plates-than-ever-on-tennessee-roads 

I know racists have been emboldened in the past couple of years, but I'm trying to think about it and wondering if there would be some other reason for someone to display a confederate flag other than to boldly advertise their racism and ignorance. I can't think of any other reason. Anyone else?

 
This article does an admirable job explaining it:

https://www.nashvillescene.com/news/pith-in-the-wind/article/21014070/heres-why-more-people-are-displaying-confederate-license-plates 

"But the thing that makes me laugh and then cringe is that you know, you just know, they’re going to insist that they’re not being racist, that it’s about heritage, not hate. They’re going to insist that we look at their little hate symbol and pretend along with them that it’s about whatever lie they’re gaslighting themselves with.


It hurts their feelings if we point out that the flag that’s been a symbol of racism, hatred, division and treasonous abandonment of the United States since it was invented is, indeed, a symbol of those things. Or they claim it hurts their feelings.


What I really think is going on here is that it makes them feel powerful. They get to feel powerful that they can publicly display a racist symbol and not only can no one stop them, the state supports them in it. And as long as they can insist on people treating them like they’re not racist, they get to feel the power that comes with bending truth toward lies."
Click to expand...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
There are lots of variances of why people fly the confederate flag.  Someone sitting in Kentucky or Georgia or Louisiana very well might view it as part of their heritage.  Some have convinced themselves it's a symbol of their fight against the federal government and state's rights.

Someone sitting in Nebraska or Iowa might do it because it makes them feel rebellious against governmental authority.  Some ignorant SOBs probably still do it in those areas claiming it's part of their heritage even though their state was fighting against it (or not even formed yet).

However, I have yet to find someone who flies that flag and at the same time argues for equality and tolerance of various groups in the US.  So, weather it's conscious or unconscious, there's a lot of 'isms tied to the flag that draws people to it.

 
I stopped at Wal-mart once about a year ago and saw a guy with a truck that had an American flag and Confederate flag mounted on the bed of his truck. And on the cab window he had a giant Marines decal. 

latest




 
Fru said:
I stopped at Wal-mart once about a year ago and saw a guy with a truck that had an American flag and Confederate flag mounted on the bed of his truck. And on the cab window he had a giant Marines decal. 

latest
Click to expand...


Sometimes I pretend to be Sherlock Holmes and manufacture an entire life story for someone based on clues (some subtle, some not-so-subtle) that they provide about themselves. You can tell a lot about a person by the bumper stickers they plaster to their vehicles. 

Making assumptions and adhering to stereotypes is not the right thing to do, of course, but it still makes you think!

 
I think the pushback against the Confederate flag has been somewhat recent, as in, the past 15-20ish years.  In my childhood it was a non-threatening relic of bygone days. The Dukes of Hazzard most famously displayed the flag, and they were accepted throughout the country as "good ol' boys" and there was no racism inherent in the show. 

I think post-WWI / WWII the whole concept of the rebellious South took a huge backstep.  We came together pretty well as a country, especially in WWII, which required total war/participation. During that time there was plenty of racism, the KKK was alive & well, but for the rest of the country (as in, not the antebellum South) there were no worries about that flag. The racists kept their thoughts mostly to themselves, and a couple of generations lived & grew without giving the Confederate flag much thought.

I genuinely think electing a Black man as president is what brought that simmering racism to a boil.  Much like the erecting of Civil War statues follows a pattern of civil rights advances by Blacks, once Obama entered the White House, racists responded. 

 
Ulty said:
I see quite a few confederate flags from time to time. I live in a conservative district of southwestern Ohio, close to the Kentucky and Indiana borders. I see confederate flag emblems on cars, on license plate covers, draped in the windows of houses. Not too long ago I saw a young man (teens or early 20s) driving a beater of a car with a full sized confederate flag flying out the window, flagpole and all.

Now I see this article:

"The number of Tennesseans with Confederate battle flag license plates has reached its highest point in a decade."

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/tennessee/articles/2018-07-19/more-confederate-license-plates-than-ever-on-tennessee-roads 

I know racists have been emboldened in the past couple of years, but I'm trying to think about it and wondering if there would be some other reason for someone to display a confederate flag other than to boldly advertise their racism and ignorance. I can't think of any other reason. Anyone else?
Click to expand...
My step daughter married a guy she met in A school in the Navy,who is from Virginia,my ex and I flew out of Norfolk to meet his family,who are black,on a visit to my son in laws aunts house there was an old confederate flag framed on a wall with some old pictures of a few black confederate solders who they say are family.Are they racist for having this displayed in their home? The subject quickly moved to the BBQ we were there for and I wasn't sure if this was the best time for a mostly white guy to question this.My son in law hates it but recognizes it as his family history.

 
man eating mastodon said:
My step daughter married a guy she met in A school in the Navy,who is from Virginia,my ex and I flew out of Norfolk to meet his family,who are black,on a visit to my son in laws aunts house there was an old confederate flag framed on a wall with some old pictures of a few black confederate solders who they say are family.Are they racist for having this displayed in their home? The subject quickly moved to the BBQ we were there for and I wasn't sure if this was the best time for a mostly white guy to question this.My son in law hates it but recognizes it as his family history.
Click to expand...


That is very interesting, and I am sure there is quite the fascinating story behind that. In this case, I would not jump to the conclusion that they are racist, but this is also a rather unique story. It would be a more confusing matter if they are driving around waving the flag off the back of their truck though. You should try to get the background story to this one.

 
BigRedBuster said:
However, I have yet to find someone who flies that flag and at the same time argues for equality and tolerance of various groups in the US.  So, weather it's conscious or unconscious, there's a lot of 'isms tied to the flag that draws people to it.
Click to expand...
I've never really thought about it like this before but this is an incredibly astute observation.  :thumbs

@Ulty, in response to your OP, I think it largely boils down to a mixed c$%ktail of pride, rebellion and (in many cases) outright bigotry. Any person who flies the Confederate Flag, regardless of their 'reason,' is choosing to ignore the inherently racist and offensive aspects of the flag.

In my opinion, it's akin to someone flying a Nazi flag and saying it stands for their family heritage, strength, military power, economic growth, nationalism, etc. It also stands for corruption, murder, genocide, hate and racism, and those things can't be separated.

 
BigRedBuster said:
There are lots of variances of why people fly the confederate flag.  Someone sitting in Kentucky or Georgia or Louisiana very well might view it as part of their heritage.  Some have convinced themselves it's a symbol of their fight against the federal government and state's rights.

Someone sitting in Nebraska or Iowa might do it because it makes them feel rebellious against governmental authority.  Some ignorant SOBs probably still do it in those areas claiming it's part of their heritage even though their state was fighting against it (or not even formed yet).

However, I have yet to find someone who flies that flag and at the same time argues for equality and tolerance of various groups in the US.  So, weather it's conscious or unconscious, there's a lot of 'isms tied to the flag that draws people to it.
Click to expand...


Great points. But even if someone legitimately feels that this is part of their heritage (I would like to hear some southern folks rationally flesh out that idea in detail as well), or if someone is waving the flag just for the anti-authority value, does that not also at least imply a large level of ignorance regarding how others would perceive their use of the flag, especially what it means in today's volatile climate? I mean, I get it if someone has deep affection for their home state, but no matter how much I loved my home, I would not want to fly a controversial symbol that would brand me as a racist, whether it was correct or not.

I don't want to trigger Godwin's law here, but Germany has a rich but checkered history. Even if I was a proud German, I would not be flying the swastika all over the place, regardless of my heritage.

Your last point, about it being conscious versus unconscious, is intriguing. Am I wrong in thinking that the unconscious side of it is simply willful ignorance, since the confederate flag is such a widely known symbol of controversy?

Edit: @Enhance, we had the same thoughts at once, but I think you stated it better and more succinctly than I did.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
man eating mastodon said:
My step daughter married a guy she met in A school in the Navy,who is from Virginia,my ex and I flew out of Norfolk to meet his family,who are black,on a visit to my son in laws aunts house there was an old confederate flag framed on a wall with some old pictures of a few black confederate solders who they say are family.Are they racist for having this displayed in their home? The subject quickly moved to the BBQ we were there for and I wasn't sure if this was the best time for a mostly white guy to question this.My son in law hates it but recognizes it as his family history.
Click to expand...


 I would say that it is wrong to assume that everyone who flies this flag is inherently racist.  Many may just be ignorant as to how others view it.  That doesn't make them racist.

 
Back
Top