Denying science in the classroom

[Making Chimichangas]

I understand why you might feel that way, Redux. But if you're going to be honest, you have to acknowledge that Christians are also snotty and arrogant in their belief, and inherently belief in god is a belief that atheists are wrong.

The Evangelical Persecution Complex

I have a particular relative who is adamant in the belief that there is, "A demonic war being waged against Christians in America..."

The article you've linked to is a perfect example of how skewed perceptions, and not taking the time to dig into a story, can confirm already existing biases and beliefs.

Another example, Kim Davis, the hypocritical, self-righteous, holier-than-thou county clerk in Kentucky who was sent to jail.

Mike Huckabee and other religious fanatics painted this as defacto "proof" that Christians were being persecuted because of their faith.

In reality, Kim Davis was sent to jail because she violated the law. But that didn't stop the religious right from lying about what happened and why.

 

[Landlord]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

 

[Making Chimichangas]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

Well when we start burning christians at the stake, or torturing them until they renounce their beliefs, and we do it for 1,000 years or so, then the scales will be closer to even.

And Landlord, to equate atheist derision of said christian beliefs to the actual horrors and atrocities that christians have done to us through the ages...

 

[NM11046]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

That's an interesting perception LOMS. My experience is quite different - I have far more people in my life who push their christianity on me or whomever they are around - the atheists tend to be pretty darn quiet. (that's usually the first clue)

 

[Landlord]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

Well when we start burning christians at the stake, or torturing them until they renounce their beliefs, and we do it for 1,000 years or so, then the scales will be closer to even.

And Landlord, to equate atheist derision of said christian beliefs to the actual horrors and atrocities that christians have done to us through the ages...

I'm not talking about the history of mankind. I'm talking about America in 2017, and I'm also talking percentages, not total values.

NM - same bit about ratios vs total numbers, but then again, maybe I spend too much time on the internet and associate with far more atheist friends than bigoted Christian ones.

 

[knapplc]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

How big of a sample size do you need? We can look at the various activities of the church throughout the middle ages, the Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, on up to the various iterations of witch trials throughout the ages that are still being perpetrated today, burned synagogues, atrocities committed against Native Americans, the Catholic priest scandals...

Christianity has millions upon millions of victims. What's a proper sample size?

 

[JJ Husker]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

Well when we start burning christians at the stake, or torturing them until they renounce their beliefs, and we do it for 1,000 years or so, then the scales will be closer to even.

And Landlord, to equate atheist derision of said christian beliefs to the actual horrors and atrocities that christians have done to us through the ages...

Can you show us all where he actually did this?

 

[JJ Husker]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

How big of a sample size do you need? We can look at the various activities of the church throughout the middle ages, the Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, on up to the various iterations of witch trials throughout the ages that are still being perpetrated today, burned synagogues, atrocities committed against Native Americans, the Catholic priest scandals...

Christianity has millions upon millions of victims. What's a proper sample size?

I believe he was saying the sample size for atheists behaving like buttholes was the much smaller sample size.

 

[Mierin]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

I don't agree with this at all.
Knapp asked earlier about closedmindedness about religion and I said it's a tie but this is a different topic. When actually discussing religion it's a tie.

Athiests are much less likely to try to force their beliefs on people or bring up religion uninvited. Christians in my experience are much more judgemental and do it when nobody is asking.

When I was a teenager a local pastor come into my mom's place of work after hours (he also owned an internet service) to work on her computer while I was working and told me the music I was listening to was evil and I should stop. I was on my mom's property. It was Cher.

A couple years later he was caught cheating on his wife and left her and their daughter to move in with the girlfriend.

Anecdotal I know but Christians are also more likely to be hypocrites in my experience.

Another semi-related anecdote; I don't flout my Christianity all over the place and I don't think I've ever talked about it on Facebook. I have a FB friend who is anti-vaxx, doesn't believe in climate change, is very anti-Muslim and anti-gay marriage. I've argued with her a couple times and both times she tried to convince me to believe in Jesus and become a Christian. Not that it matters at all but I've been Christian for years longer than she has. But she didn't bother asking because clearly anyone who doesn't want to use man-made laws to punish sinners can't be a Christian.

 

[JJ Husker]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

That's an interesting perception LOMS. My experience is quite different - I have far more people in my life who push their christianity on me or whomever they are around - the atheists tend to be pretty darn quiet. (that's usually the first clue)

Hmmm, that's interesting. I'm going to have to agree with LOMS on this one. Not saying your experience couldn't be different but my experience mirrors what LOMS said. But, I also really make an effort to avoid Christians that act that way. For some reason, even though I am Christian (or maybe because of it) I find that behavior much more detestable in a Christian than I do in an atheist. And I will admit I know extremely few admitted atheists outside of internet forums so my sample size of Christians is very large compared to atheists.

 

[knapplc]

Everything referencing a nastiness comparison will be anecdotal. I've seen plenty of self-described atheists act like complete a$$hole$ online - more than I could count. I've also seen where many of them get called out on it, and when they do, they claim some justification for their anger/hatred because of past abuse from someone involved in the church. I couldn't fathom if those accounts are true, but I could understand if some of them were. It's hard to be charitable toward someone or something that you perceive hurt you.

I've also seen plenty of self-described Christians cloak themselves in "high-and-mightiness," both in person and online. It's ugly, too, and no less justified when deployed against someone who doesn't share your faith than atheists who blame all Christians for their hurt they say they suffered. The worst is when family members do it. You hate to see that, but then my family members hate that I'm not Christian, so I suppose that disappointment runs both ways.

 

[knapplc]

Moiraine, I don't know if I knew you were Christian before this thread. It's not something you discuss much.

 

[NM11046]

I'd say the percentage of atheists that behave more as nasty, anti-theists is higher than the percentage of self-identified Christians who act high and mighty towards anyone not in the club. But, you're dealing with a much smaller sample size.

Well when we start burning christians at the stake, or torturing them until they renounce their beliefs, and we do it for 1,000 years or so, then the scales will be closer to even.

And Landlord, to equate atheist derision of said christian beliefs to the actual horrors and atrocities that christians have done to us through the ages...

I'm not talking about the history of mankind. I'm talking about America in 2017, and I'm also talking percentages, not total values.

NM - same bit about ratios vs total numbers, but then again, maybe I spend too much time on the internet and associate with far more atheist friends than bigoted Christian ones.

Aye - now you say bigoted .. I can't say mine are that necessarily but the "high and mighty if you're not in the club" christians yes for sure.

I try (believe me it's been a challenge of late) to give most people an initial pass on the bigot label - it tends to be that they're very sheltered and just unable to understand or empathize with anyone that is different than them. But when there's a lack of desire to understand or try and get to know others then I'm happy to anoint them as such.

 

[Mierin]

Moiraine, I don't know if I knew you were Christian before this thread. It's not something you discuss much.

I've said it quite a few times in other topics but I don't talk about Christianity much.

That said I'd never try to convert someone before I even asked them if they're Christian. Not that I try to convert people anyway. People know where to buy a Bible.

 

[JJ Husker]

Everything referencing a nastiness comparison will be anecdotal. I've seen plenty of self-described atheists act like complete a$$hole$ online - more than I could count. I've also seen where many of them get called out on it, and when they do, they claim some justification for their anger/hatred because of past abuse from someone involved in the church. I couldn't fathom if those accounts are true, but I could understand if some of them were. It's hard to be charitable toward someone or something that you perceive hurt you.

I've also seen plenty of self-described Christians cloak themselves in "high-and-mightiness," both in person and online. It's ugly, too, and no less justified when deployed against someone who doesn't share your faith than atheists who blame all Christians for their hurt they say they suffered. The worst is when family members do it. You hate to see that, but then my family members hate that I'm not Christian, so I suppose that disappointment runs both ways.

Agreed.