Does NU have a chance in the B1G West?

gossamorharpy said:
Im going to get roasted for this, per usual, but its all about geography and proximity to talent.  While the Midwest produces some quality skill position players every year, simple statistics will show that schools in east, south and west, with much larger and more metro areas are simply going to produce more. This is backed up by many data points but if you simply overlay a map where all the espn 300 recruits are located each year , you’ll find almost a U shape that stretches from California, to Texas, all over the south and then up the eastern seaboard.  Ohio state is a major outlier because they are the only major P5 program in a state that has talent (not counting cinci in this that historically has not been P5).  States like Texas, Florida and California individually have more people and metro areas than most of the big ten region combined.  If I’m a head coach, it’s a helluva lot easier for me to visit 20 4-5star recruits in a few days compared to the Midwest, it’s simple proximity, travel logistics and limited time in the day.
 

Another thing, most of the big ten teams are run heavy because you can find lineman and it’s a b!^@h to throw the ball starting in late October and November.  Run heavy teams are never going to fare well in generalized offensive stats that tends to favor points, yards and various stats that are largely ranked off quantity in descending order.
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Not roasting you at all.

But, that would explain why B1G west teams can't compete with teams in the East, South and West.  But, how come the offenses can't produce against defenses from other B1G west teams?

 
gossamorharpy said:
Another thing, most of the big ten teams are run heavy because you can find lineman and it’s a b!^@h to throw the ball starting in late October and November.  Run heavy teams are never going to fare well in generalized offensive stats that tends to favor points, yards and various stats that are largely ranked off quantity in descending order.
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Build a dome stadium instead of renovation

 
BigRedBuster said:
Not roasting you at all.

But, that would explain why B1G west teams can't compete with teams in the East, South and West.  But, how come the offenses can't produce against defenses from other B1G west teams?
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feels like in recent history (past 5-10 years) no one in the west besides us and Purdue try to do anything explosive on offense. Everyone for the most part is playing field position game and limiting mistakes. I’m interested to see how fickell’s experiment in Madison will work out given what he’s expressed.

using Wisconsin- I think they’ve actually put up some great offenses the past decade (before Christ really implemented his style) but they don’t always appear explosive if purely looking at stats. They had some filthy offenses around those lines and backs. Didn’t they take down Oregon and a few other teams in new years bowls in some high scoring affairs? 

 
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gossamorharpy said:
it’s a b!^@h to throw the ball starting in late October and November
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I don't buy into this.  I think its just old school thinking from the 70s and 80s.  Weather has to be complete s#!t for it to effect the game.  There is maybe 1, at most 2 games a year where weather causes problems throwing the football.  Ohio St constantly throws for 250+ yards in Oct and Nov.  The winningest all time coach at Purdue ran the spread.

 
Red Five said:
I don't buy into this.  I think its just old school thinking from the 70s and 80s.  Weather has to be complete s#!t for it to effect the game.  There is maybe 1, at most 2 games a year where weather causes problems throwing the football.  Ohio St constantly throws for 250+ yards in Oct and Nov.  The winningest all time coach at Purdue ran the spread.
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Throwing for 250 yards is not what I would consider a high powered offense. We will never have the depth and quality of athletes of Ohio state so there’s no point in using them as a peer example.

I already mentioned purdue

 
Undone said:
Those are just their passing numbers, though. Last year Ohio State averaged 192 rushing yards per game, so if we add those two numbers together and then look at Ohio State's record over the last decade we're going to say they're not "high powered?"
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Of course they have a high powered offense, I never said they didnt.  My response was to a poster saying the perception that its tough to throw in oct/nov in the midwest is an overblown stance from the past.  Having been at countless games at memorial and across the big ten/big 12 come late fall and the wind is whipping with a crisp cool air, i couldnt disagree more. 

 
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Doesn't the BIG historically have very good records in bowl games against those West, South, and East teams? 

I'm still of the belief that the BIG is and always will be a "3 yards and a cloud of dust" type conference.  If you aren't the defenses in this league will eat you alive. (See Scott Frost, "they'll adjust to us") The only way you are pulling off anything other than that type offense consistently is if you have major league talent. ie Ohio State.

 
I do tend to believe Nebraska' position in the CFB landscape, as well as the climate and weather patterns, lend itself more towards having a high powered rushing attack. Columbus, OH, isn't a hugely different from Lincoln, NE, in regards to weather (probably a bit windier in Lincoln), but tOSU also does tend to have better athletes who I think are in a better position to make a passing attack more consistently successful.

It reminds me of Green Bay of all places and their ability to have Hall of Fame quarterbacks. Green Bay's weather sucks in the fall/winter, but it's also the NFL where you get the best of the best talent, so they're able to make some of those things work consistently. I've never been particularly convinced that Nebraska can compete at a high level in a passing attack because of all of those factors, which was something that made me nervous about Frost's hiring and if he decided he wanted to be heavily pass oriented. That's not to say Nebraska could NEVER do it, I just don't think they're in a strong position for it.

 
Enhance said:
I do tend to believe Nebraska' position in the CFB landscape, as well as the climate and weather patterns, lend itself more towards having a high powered rushing attack. Columbus, OH, isn't a hugely different from Lincoln, NE, in regards to weather (probably a bit windier in Lincoln), but tOSU also does tend to have better athletes who I think are in a better position to make a passing attack more consistently successful.

It reminds me of Green Bay of all places and their ability to have Hall of Fame quarterbacks. Green Bay's weather sucks in the fall/winter, but it's also the NFL where you get the best of the best talent, so they're able to make some of those things work consistently. I've never been particularly convinced that Nebraska can compete at a high level in a passing attack because of all of those factors, which was something that made me nervous about Frost's hiring and if he decided he wanted to be heavily pass oriented. That's not to say Nebraska could NEVER do it, I just don't think they're in a strong position for it.
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You don't have to be heavily pass oriented to have success, you just need to be competent with a smart and capable QB. We can still focus on the run, but do well passing to complement.  It is so limiting to be one dimensional and that is something we've long struggled with.  We can get plenty of good enough athletes, don't need first round draft pick WR, to keep teams off balance and be able to pass when we need to.

It absolutely takes better/consistent line play, and a solid quarterback.  Doesn't have to be a 5 star like CJ Stroud, but why not a Brock Purdy or a Kenny Pickett? We can get guys like that and make this happen. 

 
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runningblind said:
You don't have to be heavily pass oriented to have success, you just need to be competent with a smart and capable QB. We can still focus on the run, but do well passing to complement.  It is so limiting to be one dimensional and that is something we've long struggled with.  We can get plenty of good enough athletes, don't need first round draft pick WR, to keep teams off balance and be able to pass when we need to.

It absolutely takes better/consistent line play, and a solid quarterback.  Doesn't have to be a 5 star like CJ Stroud, but why not a Brock Purdy or a Kenny Pickett? We can get guys like that and make this happen. 
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Kinda depends on what you mean by guys like Brock Purdy and Kenny Pickett. Do you mean mid 3-star QBs that no one else is really going after? We can do that, but most of them are not Kenny Pickett or Brock Purdy. If it was easy to tell, they wouldn't be random mid tier 3 stars.

As a side note, Matt Rhule's Temple Owls were Kenny Pickett's first offer, at least according to 247sports. He obviously chose Pitt and was in the 2017 class after Rhule had left, but was offered by Temple back in the Spring of 2015. So if there is a secret to identifying these guys Rhule would appear to have a clue.

 
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Husker in WI said:
Kinda depends on what you mean by guys like Brock Purdy and Kenny Pickett. Do you mean mid 3-star QBs that no one else is really going after? We can do that, but most of them are not Kenny Pickett or Brock Purdy. If it was easy to tell, they wouldn't be random mid tier 3 stars.

As a side note, Matt Rhule's Temple Owls were Kenny Pickett's first offer, at least according to 247sports. He obviously chose Pitt and was in the 2017 class after Rhule had left, but was offered by Temple back in the Spring of 2015. So if there is a secret to identifying these guys Rhule would appear to have a clue.
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I'm saying find guys who can throw the ball on a similar level, or teach them how.  Someone who already had the mechanics and feel.

 
runningblind said:
You don't have to be heavily pass oriented to have success, you just need to be competent with a smart and capable QB. We can still focus on the run, but do well passing to complement.  It is so limiting to be one dimensional and that is something we've long struggled with.  We can get plenty of good enough athletes, don't need first round draft pick WR, to keep teams off balance and be able to pass when we need to.

It absolutely takes better/consistent line play, and a solid quarterback.  Doesn't have to be a 5 star like CJ Stroud, but why not a Brock Purdy or a Kenny Pickett? We can get guys like that and make this happen. 
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I agree with your premise. More or less, my point was that I don't think Nebraska is in a strong position to have a high caliber passing attack to consistently compete with some of the places that recruit at a higher level. I'd much, much prefer they have a QB whose true strengths are in the passing game. Like you said, to be able to illustrate a competency. And if he's mobile/talented enough to run 3-5x per game then that's fine and probably helpful in a college offense.

Of course, that requires some better pieces around them, as well. I think people sometimes take for granted all that goes into having an effective passing attack (particularly when it comes to route running and pass blocking). The program has spent too many years where all those things don't line up enough consistently on any given play.

 
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