Notre Dame Joe
New member
And then he walked it back. Mueller had already promised he would not say anything new (ya know stuff that would put him in legal trouble) and he followed through.
DOJ Initial Russia Hearings
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ZRod
Active member
To be fair he didn't walk it back all the way. He simply said that the President could be charged once out of office, but that due to the OLC the special counsel never considered charging the president. Extrapolating from that, Mueller never once ever said that there was insufficient evidence to charge Trump with obstruction were he not the president, and he's pretty clearly said that was not able to exonerate him.
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BigRedBuster
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Ulty
New member
Wait a minute, the president that you support is a criminal, and you come to boast about it because...why? Because the Dems didn't get the solid gold soundbite they wanted? Do you have an actual take about Mueller's investigation?
Nebfanatic
New member
https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/1821272001
I think everyone is going to end up disappointed by the results of this testimony which looks like won't be mich of anything. Views weren't changed, the House won't begin impeachment and I think this will be considered a tired issue by the time election rolls around. It shouldn't be this way but I think bringing up the Mueller report a year from now isn't going to be terribly helpful. Maybe I'm just being pessamistic but I think Congress blew their chance with this thing and should have impeached already. I think hammering him on it during the campaign season will be met with responses of 'well if I did something wrong, why wasn't I punished?' Trumps base already thinks he 'won' yesterday, how will they feel a year removed from it all with no reprecussions that came from it?
I think everyone is going to end up disappointed by the results of this testimony which looks like won't be mich of anything. Views weren't changed, the House won't begin impeachment and I think this will be considered a tired issue by the time election rolls around. It shouldn't be this way but I think bringing up the Mueller report a year from now isn't going to be terribly helpful. Maybe I'm just being pessamistic but I think Congress blew their chance with this thing and should have impeached already. I think hammering him on it during the campaign season will be met with responses of 'well if I did something wrong, why wasn't I punished?' Trumps base already thinks he 'won' yesterday, how will they feel a year removed from it all with no reprecussions that came from it?
ZRod
Active member
This has to be the first step, although it should have been done months ago. Now they either need to subpoena witnesses from the report to testify before the committees in public, or proceed with impeachment so that they can subpoena everyone and anyone. Ultimately if they pursue impeachment they need to put Trump under oath, because he would lose and lose hard.
Nebfanatic
New member
I agree completely, but from what I'm reading they will not be pursuing impeachment. My question if they bring more witnesses in but not impeach is what is this for? To get soundbytes to play on the campaign? I don't like that as I've said over and over. I think that idea will backfire on them. I really think they should go forward with impeachment but at this point that doesn't look likely.
ZRod
Active member
First and foremost to sway the American Public's opinion. They probably do need to go straight to impeachment, which they will get, but they will never convict in the Senate. So, what's the point?
Nebfanatic
New member
I guess I don't see anything swaying public opinion more than Trump under oath and I also think its important for precendents sake.
Either way they will spin it as Trump beat the case though. Either they investigated him and found nothing or they tried to impeach him and couldn't convict because there was nothing there. That will be the line he feeds his base when the democratic candidate tries to hammer him on this.
It's quite disturbing to think Trump might get 4 more years despite all of the brazen criminal activity but thats where we are at right now unfortunately.
Ulty
New member
Trump's legacy after he is gone from the presidency is going to be garbage. When he is no longer protected by the privileges of the office, he will likely (hopefully) be buried by criminal charges, lawsuits, and the weight of history. Once he's gone, current Republicans will try to distance themselves from the stain of the Trump era as much as possible so they can fit whatever narratives suits them in the future, so those Republicans can preserve their own standing. If Trump is impeached, any Republican who votes to let him off will have to live with the stain of that vote, and maybe Trump's horrible legacy will take down some of those Republicans.
The Democrats' failure to impeach will only empower future Republicans to claim that they could have voted to impeach Trump but never got the chance (even if we know it is BS, we also know that a lot of voters will fall for that), and will empower future corrupt politicians of all stripes to bend boundaries and break the law, knowing that there is no accountability. Impeachment needs to happen.
Nebfanatic
New member
Why would they do anything to protect our elections when interference is benefitting them?
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ZRod
Active member
Making fun of Mueller's hearing is pretty disrespectful. The dude is a decorated combat veteran. Anyone who has spent time in the military is more than likely going to have hearing issues. My grandfather had horrible hearing after serving in the Pacific Theater. My dad never saw combat while in the army, but he has tinnitus and wears hearing aids. Bringing the hearing issue up really pisses me off. They should have got him earphones...