TGHusker
New member
Yes agreed but we know the GOP will ignore that responsibility - therefore it is up to the Dems to do so.
DOJ Initial Russia Hearings
- Thread starter NM11046
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ZRod
Active member
Honestly from what I've seen/heard today Mueller isn't helping his case. I get that the report stands in it's own, but when the special counsel seems confused, can't hear/understand questions, and is barely answering questions it doesn't look very good. Republicans are looking like the winners today for anyone who was previously "undecided".
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knapplc
Active member
Who cares if he isn't a good public speaker? The facts of the report are plain to see.
I cannot imagine a scenario - other than "good men doing nothing" - where the Republicans come out of this with a win.
How is this a win:
He's baldly accusing the Trump campaign of criminal activity.
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TGHusker
New member
When the GOP spends there time attacking the process or the investigators, it doesn't place trump in good light - as their only defense is not to defend against the charges but to attack the messengers and the process. Just too much smoke not to see the fire here. I think one has to be blinded by bias not to see the smoke.
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QMany
New member
Nebfanatic
New member
While what you are saying is true, I think Zrod makes a point. This testimony didn't sway anyone and the Republicans found ways to dig deeper into their side. Mueller is begging Congress to take action with his testimony. This thing is too muddled to let the voters decide, and beyond that it is not the voters responsibility to hold the President accountable for his crimes. If this was just a political sideshow, I'd say the Republicans came out of this as well as they could of. If the Dems were serious about getting all information needed to begin impeachment then there was absolutely no winning to be had by Republicans anyway.
knapplc
Active member
How would you know that?
Most people aren't going to read the Mueller Report. I know I haven't, and I don't plan to. Now they have sound bites that will be played from today through the next election, of Mueller telling these committees that Trump actively sought out assistance from the Russians for his campaign.
People don't read. But they'll watch a 30 second video. That's what these hearings achieved.
ZRod
Active member
I haven't been able to hear or watch much of this afternoon's hearing, and missed some of the mornings.
All I'm saying is it will be easy to get sound bites and quotes to smear Mueller with and create more doubts that furher conspiracies. I'm firmly on the side that Trump needs to be impeached and brought up on charges of obstruction, campaign finance violations, and some of his family/team on conspiracy. It's just that we learned nothing new and it's easy for Republicans to cast doubts on Mueller as they have been from the start.
knapplc
Active member
How do you know we learned nothing new if you aren't watching?
Did you know before this that Mueller finds Trump's written replies untruthful, and that Trump refused to answer follow-up questions? If so, how?
Nebfanatic
New member
Personally I don't think those 30 second videos will do much. I was watching the reaction on twitter. People see the videos, they hear what is being said but they don't believe it or think it is a set up. People are entrenched and they don't want to look stupid now so they will just dig further. I really don't think the testimony did any good as campaign ammo. People got confirmation out of this testimony on both sides. The Republicans don't think the invesigation was warrented and don't believe obstruction is possible because of that. I've already seen all of GOP twitter discredit Mueller completely because he said Fusion GPS was out of his purview. Its a ridiculous take, but that is what is happening. Its up to Congress right now.
VectorVictor
Donor
There's nothing honest about this take--attacking the messenger because you don't like the message is avoidance in addressing the issues in question, especially when Mueller did answer the questions in a satisfactory manner.
Bulls**t. That's willful ignorance right there--Mueller clearly answered the questions and responded accordingly.
For a sane, rational actor, the Mueller Report (at least what we've been able to see) already shows obstruction on the part of the sitting President to anyone that doesn't want to turn a blind eye to his actions, and it clearly demonstrates (along with Mueller's testimony) that Russia's continued interference is a threat to our democracy that isn't been addressed because the President is compromised.
Digging in further and supporting Trump after this is pure gamesmanship of politics--we want our guy to win no matter what--and is morally reprehensible. And this is excluding the valid charges of overt racism and sexual assaults.
Seriously--if having "your guy" in the White House matters more than morals, ethics, integrity, or honesty, then your party is beyond saving.
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knapplc
Active member
The bots on twitter were discrediting Mueller so this was ineffective. OK.
I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree.
TGHusker
New member
That was pretty much the GOP tactic - avoid the truth, the smoke and fire and attack the fireman trying to do something about it.