Huge Dilemma
- Thread starter HANC
- Start date
HANC
New member
I am glad that I am not Trev right now (well......)
Scenario 1:
almost 100% of people agree that the path that got us in this position is the coaching carousel that has happened over the past decade +. Furthermore, many people will or did say that a bonus of hiring SF is the fact that he would get a "longer leash" if things aren't going well, thus, ending the vicious cycle of changing coaches and schemes. Well, the same fans that were saying this are falling victim to their own impatience, thinking that the solution is going right back to the "root of the problem". Furthermore, after post-Bo, the previous guys have failed, why is it a guarantee the answer is a new guy?
Scenario 2:
Trev give SF another year, the fan base will be completely divided and we may be stuck just treading water for the sake of "giving him a longer leash". Will SF have the guts to replace AM (for those who believe he is the problem), and basically start the make or break hot seat year with a brand new signal caller? If he doesn't make changes, it is difficult to think we will see any improvement. If he makes changes with the staff, it will be extremely difficult for SF to bring great coaches on board. I can't see any coach worth his salt, possibly giving up a gig to come to Lincoln on a 1 year trial basis, knowing good an well if the record isn't good, the staff will be fired.
I am not stating which scenario I am supporting, not because I am afraid of debate, but truly because I am not sure which is the lesser of two evils at this point.
Scenario 1:
almost 100% of people agree that the path that got us in this position is the coaching carousel that has happened over the past decade +. Furthermore, many people will or did say that a bonus of hiring SF is the fact that he would get a "longer leash" if things aren't going well, thus, ending the vicious cycle of changing coaches and schemes. Well, the same fans that were saying this are falling victim to their own impatience, thinking that the solution is going right back to the "root of the problem". Furthermore, after post-Bo, the previous guys have failed, why is it a guarantee the answer is a new guy?
Scenario 2:
Trev give SF another year, the fan base will be completely divided and we may be stuck just treading water for the sake of "giving him a longer leash". Will SF have the guts to replace AM (for those who believe he is the problem), and basically start the make or break hot seat year with a brand new signal caller? If he doesn't make changes, it is difficult to think we will see any improvement. If he makes changes with the staff, it will be extremely difficult for SF to bring great coaches on board. I can't see any coach worth his salt, possibly giving up a gig to come to Lincoln on a 1 year trial basis, knowing good an well if the record isn't good, the staff will be fired.
I am not stating which scenario I am supporting, not because I am afraid of debate, but truly because I am not sure which is the lesser of two evils at this point.
BigRedBuster
Active member
If Frost is given the chance to do this, I think this is somewhat over blown. Assistant coaches are used to moving every year or two. Go find a coordinator that's tearing it up at a G5 program, bring him in and pay him a ton. This gives him his break into the P5 world and if he's successful, he's made for life. If the staff is dumped in a year, he just goes back to a G5 program again.....or, another P5.
Personally, I believe it might be the right thing to do to keep frost and open up the bank account for top assistants. If they aren't successful, you've spent maybe 2-3 million and saved 5 million in buy out money.
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Hilltop
Active member
Good topic.
I do agree that switching coaches has, to a degree, put us in this position. Digging deeper, I think switching coaches who run drastically different schemes has really been the issue. In a couple instances we hired people just to hire them instead of choosing what style of football we wanted to play. That resulted in a lot of "empty" rosters for the incoming coach. If we do indeed make a change, I really hope the new coach runs schemes that can utilize the current roster.
Born N Bled Red
New member
Truth of the matter is, Frost bought into the full overhaul getting youth in place to exceed in years 3 and 4 with an experienced senior team. Year 3 was screwed by Covid, year 4 has the hardest schedule on record for the Huskers. His first two years were supposed to be down years under this plan, everyone has understood that, yet is now throwing those records at Frost as a reason to justify their impatience.
In my mind, Frost's clock shouldn't have truly started until year 3 which ended up being covid year. He went 3-5 against an all conference schedule. Give the team the 3 patsy's they were supposed to play they probably at least go 6-6. - Progress.
Year 4- we are on the cusp of beating top ten teams - strange flukes keep us out of the win column- still - progress.
Year -5 under the full rebuild scenario is truly his year 3 in which we should see significant results if the gamble on a full rebuild was worth the pain. Heck even Saban went 3-8 or whatever at Alabama his first year.
A lot was wrapped up in the firing of Frank Solich back to 2003. It signaled a new era at NU in the way we look at coaches and their tenures. Don't like them? Not doing well enough W-L? Fire 'em. But that wasn't the only thing. NU had a formula of power football that Frank was building upon. When we went away from that, we were almost guaranteed to spin into a down period of adjustment to a pass-oriented attack. We fired Bill, then Bo and Mike. Here we are with Scott.
What's different this time?
First off, we don't have some time honored way of playing the game. We hardly have an identity at all.
Secondly, Scott doesn't come here if we are committed to the idea of sticking with a guy through the hard times
Lastly, times have not been harder in 50-plus years. Scott seems lost. He seems like he wasn't ready for this job. We are staring straight down the barrel of 3-9 and the reality that things will not get better. We tried a plan that seemed destined to succeed and it fell flat.
In the end, we learn from this. We fire Scott. We find a coach that will be a teacher of fundamentals and who will bring physical football back to our school, because 1. It worked here in the past. 2. It's the formula for success in the Big 10. We need recruiters to make this work. We need top assistants, not the coach's buddies. Coaches that can recruit the Big 10 and mold us into a team that can win the league. We can't be what we once were by recruiting the south, Texas in particular. We have to find a new way with a seemingly familiar brand of ball.
Everyone is saying how hard this choice is when it's not hard at all.
4-8, then 5-7, then turn down a bowl when one is given to you 3-5 and then three more wins when you don't have eight chances to garner victory.... you got 12. Next season isn't going to be easier because we are fresh off losses to Purdue, Minnesota and Illinois. The tough teams in this division are Wisconsin and Iowa. And if we lose to them too, I am wondering how next year will be easier. Are we changing leagues? We still play all those teams next year too. And maybe Northwestern improves and they kick us too. A 1-5 or 2-4 division record would not be a surprise. And we play Oklahoma in the non-con. So 2-5 not counting cross over or other non-cons.
Count me out of that. This ends here. It ends with Frost leaving.
What's different this time?
First off, we don't have some time honored way of playing the game. We hardly have an identity at all.
Secondly, Scott doesn't come here if we are committed to the idea of sticking with a guy through the hard times
Lastly, times have not been harder in 50-plus years. Scott seems lost. He seems like he wasn't ready for this job. We are staring straight down the barrel of 3-9 and the reality that things will not get better. We tried a plan that seemed destined to succeed and it fell flat.
In the end, we learn from this. We fire Scott. We find a coach that will be a teacher of fundamentals and who will bring physical football back to our school, because 1. It worked here in the past. 2. It's the formula for success in the Big 10. We need recruiters to make this work. We need top assistants, not the coach's buddies. Coaches that can recruit the Big 10 and mold us into a team that can win the league. We can't be what we once were by recruiting the south, Texas in particular. We have to find a new way with a seemingly familiar brand of ball.
Everyone is saying how hard this choice is when it's not hard at all.
4-8, then 5-7, then turn down a bowl when one is given to you 3-5 and then three more wins when you don't have eight chances to garner victory.... you got 12. Next season isn't going to be easier because we are fresh off losses to Purdue, Minnesota and Illinois. The tough teams in this division are Wisconsin and Iowa. And if we lose to them too, I am wondering how next year will be easier. Are we changing leagues? We still play all those teams next year too. And maybe Northwestern improves and they kick us too. A 1-5 or 2-4 division record would not be a surprise. And we play Oklahoma in the non-con. So 2-5 not counting cross over or other non-cons.
Count me out of that. This ends here. It ends with Frost leaving.
Roundball Shaman
New member
The dilemma goes away quickly this way:
(1) If you can get a “better” coach than Frost, you get him.
(2) If you can’t get a better coach than Frost, you keep him.
And that goes for when his contract is up, too.
Additional note: Nick Saban was not successful as an NFL head coach. Bill Belichick wasn’t always the guru many people think he is now either. Lesson? You have to find your lane and grow into the role in a certain spot.
The question for the Huskers: Is the Husker job the best lane for Frost? And can he grow into a better coaching version of himself?
Question for Frost? Does he want to keep trying here or go for a fresh start like other coaches needed to become what they are today?
(1) If you can get a “better” coach than Frost, you get him.
(2) If you can’t get a better coach than Frost, you keep him.
And that goes for when his contract is up, too.
Additional note: Nick Saban was not successful as an NFL head coach. Bill Belichick wasn’t always the guru many people think he is now either. Lesson? You have to find your lane and grow into the role in a certain spot.
The question for the Huskers: Is the Husker job the best lane for Frost? And can he grow into a better coaching version of himself?
Question for Frost? Does he want to keep trying here or go for a fresh start like other coaches needed to become what they are today?
FrantzHardySwag
New member
Year 5 is Year 3, and Saban was bad in Year 1. This is now my favorite Keep Frost take.
Born N Bled Red
New member
FrantzHardySwag
New member
Saban went 7-6 his first year....so now "Year 5 is Year 3, and even Saban went 7-6 in his first year"....even better.
Lorewarn
New member
That's because he has underperformed relative to what his teams have been capable of.
Doesn't matter if a year is supposed to be a down year if we can all plainly see that we had the talent and opportunities to win 6-8 games and only won 4. 2018 was obviously going to be a down year, but the reason it was a "start 0-6 down year" was largely on bad coaching by Frost. 2019 was understandably also going to be a transition year, but we had so many chances to have it be not as bad as it was which mostly came down to coaching.
Same as this year, yeah we may have an insanely hard schedule, but we don't have a "we're only good enough for 3 wins on the season" hard schedule.
The most damning part of it is that we have the talent and we have the buy-in and the culture the way Frost wants it. So...if it's not a talent or a buy-in problem, the only problem left is bad coaching.
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Born N Bled Red
New member
You sure its not the reverse? We didn't have the talent and the coaching was the reason we had the opportunities to win seems more likely given the way Riley's tenure ended.
TGHusker
Active member
Scott has said this is his best team @ Nebraska and it has the best culture since coming here. Therefore, that leaves it up to coaching.
Hedley Lamarr
New member
What did Saban do in year 2,3,4? We have beat 2 P5 teams with winning records during Frost's tenure. Both in 2018 with a roster full of Pelini hold overs and Riley recruits. His best RB and WR were Riley guys. He is 1-6 this year against P5 teams. Yay progress!