Immigration Ban

Clifford Franklin said:
Yeah, because people in here are seriously arguing that we should keep violent criminal undocumented immigrants.

Be better Ric.
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Uh, just a few posts ago you and others were shrieking in outrage about how mean ICE was for arresting some guy driving his pregnant wife to the hospital. That guy was wanted for homicide-related charges.

So are we deporting murderers here illegally or not? So we feel sorry for them and give them a pass if the arrest is made at an inconvenient time for them? Let’s say some guy’s an illegal wanted on child rape charges. If he’s picking his kids up from school, is it okay for ICE to pick him up? Or is that too traumatic for his kids and mean to him?

Be consistent Clifford. Contradicting yourself so obviously within a few posts on the same page of a thread isn’t a great look. 

 
Ric Flair said:
This made me laugh because you clearly haven’t studied the issue and are unaware of the myriad of costs associated with illegal immigration. Along of course with the murders, rapes, and other violent crimes committed by illegals who shouldn’t be here in the first place.
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Illegal aliens commit violent crime at a lesser rate than US civilians and this is proven data so please get out with that nonsense. Its untrue or at the very least misleading. 

https://www.npr.org/2018/05/02/607652253/studies-say-illegal-immigration-does-not-increase-violent-crime

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/

https://www.cato.org/blog/murder-mollie-tibbetts-illegal-immigrant-crime-facts

 
BigRedBuster said:
First off....like I have said.  From the President on down, stop demonizing these people.  The vast majority just want a better life, came here for a job (actually want to work), are less prone to be a violent criminal than native born Americans.....etc.  Demonizing an entire group of people does nothing other than creates a false sense of fear that is not good for anyone other than a politician wanting votes.  The idiot and chief is even starting to demonize LEGAL immigrants.

Second, there are anywhere from 10 - 12 million illegal immigrants in the US.  To deport all of them, would be both a human rights disaster and destroy our economy at the same time.  On top of that, the cost of doing so would be enormous.  WAY more than the actual cost of having them here.

So, let's start with the reality, we are not deporting all illegal immigrants.  So, what's the solution?

a)  Figure out a way that people that are here can become legal.  Deport violent criminals and give the people who are here, working hard, raising their families and contributing to our communities and economy, a path to citizenship.

b)  Fix our immigration system so it's easier to immigrate legally.  The system is a disaster.  I've been familiar with or helped with two people going through it and it's almost impossible.  And...this was even long before Drumpf took office.

c)  Once that is all discussed and figured out, I'm fine with increasing border security.  We do need to know who is coming into our country.  That said, I am not under the delusion that we will stop all illegal immigration.

Fact, a very large number of people who are illegal, came here legally with a visa and over stayed the visa.  Many are even European...I guess the idiot doesn't care about them because they aren't from s#!t hole countries.

Fix the system without destroying people's lives.  The vast majority of these people are here contributing to the economy, raising their families and paying taxes....many times to a system they won't get much (if any) benefit from in the long run.

PS.....and building a friggen physical wall is the dumbest idea thrown out in the last 30 years on the subject.
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The statistics that illegals commit less crimes than people born here are complete BS and have been thoroughly debunked.

Illegals should have no rights. I’m beyond tired of hearing them whining about how we owe them something. Read up on how Mexico treats their illegal immigrants. They’re complete hypocrites.

Illegals should have to register. If they refuse, round them up and send then home. Start with the most violent. If illegals do register, let those who are consistently working and haven’t committed crimes stay with work visas. There should be no path to citizenship for those who broke our laws to come here. 

Fixing immigration should be a priority. End chain migration. Bring in highly skilled and educated workers and then less skilled workers needed for jobs the food stamp and welfare crowd is too lazy to do.

Increasing border security has to be a part of any comprehensive immigration reform. We should also amend the Constitution so that foreigners can’t come here illegally and pop out anchor babies who automatically become citizens.

 
Ric Flair said:
The statistics that illegals commit less crimes than people born here are complete BS and have been thoroughly debunked.

Illegals should have no rights. I’m beyond tired of hearing them whining about how we owe them something. Read up on how Mexico treats their illegal immigrants. They’re complete hypocrites.

Illegals should have to register. If they refuse, round them up and send then home. Start with the most violent. If illegals do register, let those who are consistently working and haven’t committed crimes stay with work visas. There should be no path to citizenship for those who broke our laws to come here. 

Fixing immigration should be a priority. End chain migration. Bring in highly skilled and educated workers and then less skilled workers needed for jobs the food stamp and welfare crowd is too lazy to do.

Increasing border security has to be a part of any comprehensive immigration reform. We should also amend the Constitution so that foreigners can’t come here illegally and pop out anchor babies who automatically become citizens.
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Can you provide proof on the crime statistic?  I’m genuinely curious.

 
StPaulHusker said:
Can you provide proof on the crime statistic?  I’m genuinely curious.
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Pretty sure it was already covered in this thread that the debunking was dubious at best. The main issue is that they factored in an illegal status as a crime. Therefore immigrants, both legal and illegal, on average commit more crime. There was a lot more to it, but I think that was a big issue.

Actually @Ric Flair illegals aliens do have rights just as any other immigrant has rights, infact we as citizens share almost all the same rights under the Constitution as any immigrant does. This is not indispute and would be a gross display of dehumanization to revoke their rights. I don't give a s#!t what Mexico does, we are not them.

 
Ric Flair said:
Fixing immigration should be a priority. End chain migration. Bring in highly skilled and educated workers and then less skilled workers needed for jobs the food stamp and welfare crowd is too lazy to do.
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This made me laugh because it’s literally the situation we have right now. Illegal immigration is almost (and maybe is) a non issue because it has steadily decreased for 20+ years now under the pre-Trump policies, and because it likely isn’t a negative for our society. It would be a negative if we just opened up our borders which you’ve falsely claimed is a mainstream liberal goal, but no one who isn’t crazy has called for that.

The status quo on immigration was working perfectly fine, and changing illegal immigration policy is probably the 50th most important thing this country needed to do and is a huge waste of $.

It’s been blown up by Trump because he’s a racist and so are many of his followers, subconsciously or otherwise.

 
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Moiraine said:
This made me laugh because it’s literally the situation we have right now. Illegal immigration is almost (and maybe is) a non issue because it has steadily decreased for 20+ years now under the pre-Trump policies, and because it likely isn’t a negative for our society. It would be a negative if we just opened up our borders which you’ve falsely claimed is a mainstream liberal goal, but no one who isn’t crazy has called for that.

The status quo on immigration was working perfectly fine, and changing illegal immigration policy is probably the 50th most important thing this country needed to do and is a huge waste of $.

It’s been blown up by Trump because he’s a racist and so are many of his followers, subconsciously or otherwise.
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I don't agree with the bold. It's a slow frustrating process. Getting a green card takes nearly a decade. I know a lot of good engineers from various countries that are still waiting for theirs after several years (they're your best and brightest). It could surely be improve. But it has been fairly effective at keeping us safe so far.

 
ZRod said:
I don't agree with the bold. It's a slow frustrating process. Getting a green card takes nearly a decade. I know a lot of good engineers from various countries that are still waiting for theirs after several years (they're your best and brightest). It could surely be improve. But it has been fairly effective at keeping us safe so far.
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I was talking mostly of illegal immigration, but ya I agree. It took my ex roommate with a Statistics degree 2 years, which comparatively is fast, but she was sponsored by a university and had been living and studying in the U.S. for 7 years prior to that.

I hate the attitude a lot of people have about immigrants in general. I work for a Nebraska company and about half of my area (which would be considered "skilled workers") is immigrants from China, India, Europe, and Africa, because there aren't enough qualified American applicants. They're helping an American company make lots of $. We need these people.

 
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Moiraine said:
I was talking mostly of illegal immigration, but ya I agree. It took my ex roommate with a Statistics degree 2 years, which comparatively is fast, but she was sponsored by a university and had been living and studying in the U.S. for 7 years prior to that.
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Meh, it's far from perfect too. It definitely needs to be improve, but we don't need a stupid expensive wall, we don't need to separate families. We should find a way to keep productive undocumented workers here and get them legal status. How to do that. I don't know.

 
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