NBA Arguments Tangent Thread

B.B. Hemingway said:
That's the Warriors team without Kevin Durant..... Who is probably a top 10 player of all time, and is definitely a top 2 scorer. That's kind of important.
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Wow, KD as a top 10 of all time??????  KD has like 1 MVP and 2 rings.  That is about as uneventful as me having a 3some with two hands.

But KD was not on the best GS of all time?  Is that true?

He might not have even been the best player on GS.

But okay, do the match ups.

Who is guarding who and in those matchups who has the advantages?

Centers, even, we know that.

Big 3

MJ

Pip

Rodman

Steph 

Klay
KD

 
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You can keep talking about individual match-ups, but one of the things that made the Warriors so successful, even without Durant, was a constant ball-motion offense that discouraged the individual isolation game, and a relentless team defense that used constant switches and strategic double teams. They finished virtually every big game with their "death line up" featuring 6' 7' Draymond Green at center. It shouldn't have worked but it did. Coaching and innovative scheme and a defensive guru were a big part of that run, not just your best three athletes.

And again, pretty much every former NBA great has no problem calling Kevin Durant perhaps the most difficult to defend player in NBA history. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
You can keep talking about individual match-ups, but one of the things that made the Warriors so successful, even without Durant, was a constant ball-motion offense that discouraged the individual isolation game, and a relentless team defense that used constant switches and strategic double teams. They finished virtually every big game with their "death line up" featuring 6' 7' Draymond Green at center. It shouldn't have worked but it did. Coaching and innovative scheme and a defensive guru were a big part of that run, not just your best three athletes.

And again, pretty much every former NBA great has no problem calling Kevin Durant perhaps the most difficult to defend player in NBA history. 
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I am glad you brought up coaching/.

You know where Kerr got a lot of his ideas, right?  :)

And you know that Phil Jackson was sort of a good coach.

You are also literally the only person in the world that seems to think GS is some defensive juggxrnaught.  They were up 3-1 and lost an NBA title, literally has never happened before. They were the first team ever with 69 wins to NOT win it all.

Their death lineup cost them a championship because of Draymond McKicky.

 
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Guy Chamberlin said:
You can keep talking about individual match-ups, but one of the things that made the Warriors so successful, even without Durant, was a constant ball-motion offense that discouraged the individual isolation game, and a relentless team defense that used constant switches and strategic double teams. They finished virtually every big game with their "death line up" featuring 6' 7' Draymond Green at center. It shouldn't have worked but it did. Coaching and innovative scheme and a defensive guru were a big part of that run, not just your best three athletes.

And again, pretty much every former NBA great has no problem calling Kevin Durant perhaps the most difficult to defend player in NBA history. 
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It seems pretty obvious that you have no idea what kind of basketball the Bulls played.

 
teachercd said:
I am glad you brought up coaching/.

You know where Kerr got a lot of his ideas, right?  :)

And you know that Phil Jackson was sort of a good coach.

You are also literally the only person in the world that seems to think GS is some defensive juggxrnaught.  They were up 3-1 and lost an NBA title, literally has never happened before. They were the first team ever with 69 wins to NOT win it all.

Their death lineup cost them a championship because of Draymond McKicky.
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Yeah, I guess I was defending the Warriors against the more generic flack they get, not so much the specific Bulls match-up. Kerr definitely took the triangle offense from Jackson and added some philosophies from Popovich, and brought in Ron Adams to make defense a priority for every player. The Bulls had great ball motion offense, too, and prioritized defense. It's possible that Kerr improved on the scheme over the next 20 years. 

The Warriors were literally the top rated defense in both the regular and post season in 2014/15, and second rated throughout the 73 win season, when the starters spent most fourth quarters on the bench. They never had a defensive rating less than 4th in the 5 year run in the Finals. Literally every basketball analyst has pointed out that while the Warriors offense gets all the attention, it was their defense that won the championships. 

I didn't notice that the debate had switched to just the 73 vs 72 win season, the year the Warriors didn't win the championship. Draymond was his own worst enemy, but he would not have missed game 6 if LeBron James hadn't personality lobbied the NBA to suspend him. Also, that only supports the value of the Death Line-up, it doesn't diminish it.

You linked to an in-depth comparison that said the  1996 Bulls/2016 Warriors match-up would be extremely close, but given the Warriors injuries that year and Jordan's competitive fire, they gave a slight edge to the Bulls. The next year the Warriors added Kevin Durant, and won two more championships. 

I never said the Warriors were a no-brainer, but some of the claims of the Bulls inherent superiority were getting a bit fanciful. 

 
Real basketball fans have issues with LeBron's flopping and complaining, and many refuse to elevate him to Jordan or even Kobe standards. I personally blame him for lobbying to get Draymond kicked out of Game 6 and ruining the Warriors 73 win season. LeBron has had a few of those b!^@h moves. But me and pretty much everyone else respects his game and commitment. 

But when you see LeBron bashing at this level, it's strictly partisan politics. This Outkick douchebag calls him a fraud, but LeBron's charity work is extremely legit, as are his social grievances. 

 
B.B. Hemingway said:
That's the Warriors team without Kevin Durant..... Who is probably a top 10 player of all time, and is definitely a top 2 scorer. That's kind of important.
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If you watched Durant score 49 points in 48 minutes to single-handedly beat the Bucks, you'd agree with the veteran broadcasters: KD is one of the most lethal and un-guardable scorers in NBA history. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Real basketball fans have issues with LeBron's flopping and complaining, and many refuse to elevate him to Jordan or even Kobe standards. I personally blame him for lobbying to get Draymond kicked out of Game 6 and ruining the Warriors 73 win season. LeBron has had a few of those b!^@h moves. But me and pretty much everyone else respects his game and commitment. 

But when you see LeBron bashing at this level, it's strictly partisan politics. This Outkick douchebag calls him a fraud, but LeBron's charity work is extremely legit, as are his social grievances. 
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LeBron seems like a really, really good person. And he's a fantastic basketball player, no worse than 2nd best all-time. But.... He's a douchebag. His on-court behavior might be more annoying than his off-court behavior. And I really question how much thought he puts into these, supposed, social grievances. Most annoyingly, he purposefully ignores real injustice happening in China because, well, Dolla Dolla Bill Y'all....

Guy Chamberlin said:
If you watched Durant score 49 points in 48 minutes to single-handedly beat the Bucks, you'd agree with the veteran broadcasters: KD is one of the most lethal and un-guardable scorers in NBA history. 
Click to expand...


KD (also a douche) is incredible. The argument made by some on here that the Jordan Bulls would have handled those Warrior teams is hilarious.

 
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