Oversigning

Mavric said:
I mean ... I don't like it either. Doesn't seem right. A great reason to get rid of NSD and let guys sign whenever they want.

But we just did (basically) the same thing last year. And there were several people talking about getting rid of 'dead weight' on the current roster.

Argue about the degree all you but it's not like Harbaugh is the only one. Or that recruits don't do the same thing.
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I'm not saying that you are wrong, but for the life of me I can't think of who we did this to last year. Is it Dillman as referenced above? I don't recall his exact situation (I remember something about being hurt, transferring, having to play JV). But if we did the exact same thing as Michigan (cutting him loose a couple weeks before signing day w/o any prior notice), then yes, it was a bad deal.

And I don't equate running non-contributors off that are already in the program to telling a recruit 2 weeks before signing day that we don't have room for you.

And yes, Harbaugh isn't the only one who does this, but his wacky stunts are getting all this good press, so its good to see someone take him to task.

 
Red Five said:
Mavric said:
I mean ... I don't like it either. Doesn't seem right. A great reason to get rid of NSD and let guys sign whenever they want.

But we just did (basically) the same thing last year. And there were several people talking about getting rid of 'dead weight' on the current roster.

Argue about the degree all you but it's not like Harbaugh is the only one. Or that recruits don't do the same thing.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying that you are wrong, but for the life of me I can't think of who we did this to last year. Is it Dillman as referenced above? I don't recall his exact situation (I remember something about being hurt, transferring, having to play JV). But if we did the exact same thing as Michigan (cutting him loose a couple weeks before signing day w/o any prior notice), then yes, it was a bad deal.

And I don't equate running non-contributors off that are already in the program to telling a recruit 2 weeks before signing day that we don't have room for you.

And yes, Harbaugh isn't the only one who does this, but his wacky stunts are getting all this good press, so its good to see someone take him to task.
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If he is referencing Dillman, it was mid-December. The new staff wasn't in contact with him (or many commits, if you remember), so he asked his HS coach to contact Riley's staff. They informed Dillman's coach that he no longer had a scholarship offer.

 
Red Five said:
Chicago Tribune's Teddy Greenstein drops a flying elbow on Harbaugh

Ethics no obstacle to Michigan's Jim Harbaugh dumping verbal commits

We hear about the Jim Harbaugh slumber party at a recruit's house and make lame jokes about khaki pajamas. Harbaugh stalks a California kid, sits in on his World Religions Class and the photo gets thousands of looks on social media.

It's all a diversion.

​

The real Harbaugh is the one who just told a left tackle from Downers Grove South who had been committed to Michigan orally for two-plus years to take a hike. Actually, Harbaugh didn't tell Erik Swenson. Apparently he was too busy posing for selfies. So he had his offensive line coach, Tim Drevno, do it.​
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Don't feel bad, kid. It's how Harbaugh does business. It's called "over-recruiting." Or "Colter-ing."

When Harbaugh was at Stanford, he secured an oral commitment from Kain Colter. Even had Colter spend time with fellow quarterback Andrew Luck during a campus visit.

After Colter injured his throwing shoulder, Stanford coaches asked for MRIs and pretended they needed clearance from the admissions office, despite Colter's 4.2 grade-point average. Then they stopped calling altogether.

No wonder Colter thinks college football players should be considered employees. He got fired from Stanford before he even set foot on Northwestern's campus.

Northwestern coach Pat Fitzgerald said this in 2011: "We're going to honor our commitments. The coaches who punt on guys when they get hurt, it's pathetic. It's these kids' futures."
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A different point of view http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/report--ex-michigan-recruit-s-scholarship-rescission-wasn-t-sudden-172912639.html

I say that because two weeks ago, when we began dropping major hints in our Inside The Fort columns, we were told that Swenson was no longer a Michigan commitment. We have also been told by multiple sources (though admittedly one of those sources on the Michigan side) that the Swensons were told back in November that he should be looking around because he may not have a committable offer.

We were also told by a source out of Downers Grove that the Michigan coaches asked Swenson to camp at U-M over the summer so the staff could properly evaluate him (he refused) and we were told that it was understood that Swenson’s senior year would serve as an evaluation period because this coaching staff had never seen him in-person and wanted to know if he was a good fit for the program.
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4skers89 said:
Red Five said:
Chicago Tribune's Teddy Greenstein drops a flying elbow on Harbaugh

Ethics no obstacle to Michigan's Jim Harbaugh dumping verbal commits

We hear about the Jim Harbaugh slumber party at a recruit's house and make lame jokes about khaki pajamas. Harbaugh stalks a California kid, sits in on his World Religions Class and the photo gets thousands of looks on social media.

It's all a diversion.

​

The real Harbaugh is the one who just told a left tackle from Downers Grove South who had been committed to Michigan orally for two-plus years to take a hike. Actually, Harbaugh didn't tell Erik Swenson. Apparently he was too busy posing for selfies. So he had his offensive line coach, Tim Drevno, do it.​
Click to expand...

Don't feel bad, kid. It's how Harbaugh does business. It's called "over-recruiting." Or "Colter-ing."

When Harbaugh was at Stanford, he secured an oral commitment from Kain Colter. Even had Colter spend time with fellow quarterback Andrew Luck during a campus visit.

After Colter injured his throwing shoulder, Stanford coaches asked for MRIs and pretended they needed clearance from the admissions office, despite Colter's 4.2 grade-point average. Then they stopped calling altogether.

No wonder Colter thinks college football players should be considered employees. He got fired from Stanford before he even set foot on Northwestern's campus.

Northwestern coach Pat Fitzgerald said this in 2011: "We're going to honor our commitments. The coaches who punt on guys when they get hurt, it's pathetic. It's these kids' futures."
Click to expand...
​
Click to expand...
A different point of view http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/report--ex-michigan-recruit-s-scholarship-rescission-wasn-t-sudden-172912639.html

I say that because two weeks ago, when we began dropping major hints in our Inside The Fort columns, we were told that Swenson was no longer a Michigan commitment. We have also been told by multiple sources (though admittedly one of those sources on the Michigan side) that the Swensons were told back in November that he should be looking around because he may not have a committable offer.

We were also told by a source out of Downers Grove that the Michigan coaches asked Swenson to camp at U-M over the summer so the staff could properly evaluate him (he refused) and we were told that it was understood that Swenson’s senior year would serve as an evaluation period because this coaching staff had never seen him in-person and wanted to know if he was a good fit for the program.
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Response from Greenstein:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-harbaugh-michigan-recruiting-20160122-column.html

7. What’s interesting about The Wolverine piece is that it ignores stories that ran on its own website. From September to December, it ran two stories on Swenson.


Oct. 16: “Swenson is a Staple” … 743 words without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. Swenson said he enjoyed the role of recruiter: “I was giving all the guys a tour in the museum after the game. Everyone was really interested in the history of the program and I can tell them a lot about that. The coaches use every advantage that they can get and I've been able to be a part of that. They seem to be pretty thankful for me and I'm really thankful for them. We make a good team when it comes to this kind of stuff."

Nov. 13: “Swenson with the Scoop” … 401 words, again without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. A line from the story: “He is now working as a recruiter for Michigan and will have a huge task when he returns to Ann Arbor for the Ohio Stategame.”

Does this sound like a player who was informed by coaches over the summer that his offer was conditional, that he was subject to an “evaluation period?”
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Greenstein with a follow-up today. I'd read the whole thing, but talking about the Michigan Rivals site's article above:

7. What’s interesting about The Wolverine piece is that it ignores stories that ran on its own website. From September to December, it ran two stories on Swenson.


Oct. 16: “Swenson is a Staple” … 743 words without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. Swenson said he enjoyed the role of recruiter: “I was giving all the guys a tour in the museum after the game. Everyone was really interested in the history of the program and I can tell them a lot about that. The coaches use every advantage that they can get and I've been able to be a part of that. They seem to be pretty thankful for me and I'm really thankful for them. We make a good team when it comes to this kind of stuff."

Nov. 13: “Swenson with the Scoop” … 401 words, again without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. A line from the story: “He is now working as a recruiter for Michigan and will have a huge task when he returns to Ann Arbor for the Ohio State game.”


Does this sound like a player who was informed by coaches over the summer that his offer was conditional, that he was subject to an “evaluation period?”
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Red Five said:
Greenstein with a follow-up today. I'd read the whole thing, but talking about the Michigan Rivals site's article above:

7. What’s interesting about The Wolverine piece is that it ignores stories that ran on its own website. From September to December, it ran two stories on Swenson.


Oct. 16: “Swenson is a Staple” … 743 words without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. Swenson said he enjoyed the role of recruiter: “I was giving all the guys a tour in the museum after the game. Everyone was really interested in the history of the program and I can tell them a lot about that. The coaches use every advantage that they can get and I've been able to be a part of that. They seem to be pretty thankful for me and I'm really thankful for them. We make a good team when it comes to this kind of stuff."

Nov. 13: “Swenson with the Scoop” … 401 words, again without a hint of any negative vibes from the coaching staff. A line from the story: “He is now working as a recruiter for Michigan and will have a huge task when he returns to Ann Arbor for the Ohio State game.”


Does this sound like a player who was informed by coaches over the summer that his offer was conditional, that he was subject to an “evaluation period?”
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I can see why Michigan wouldn't want this kid around their program.

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"Commitable offer"

Want to fix this? Do what Bo Pelini proposed, and eliminate the national signing day. Upon offer, a kid can accept. It would slow the entire process down.

This is a proposal preferred by every coach who is at an "outside of the top 20 or so best-situated (in terms of recruiting geography) program," but the Alabama's, Michigan's, USC's et al of the world will always oppose. And no way will the recruiting industries stand by and see their cash cow bled.

NCAA is so worthless.

 
I sort of agree. Everyone thinks it would be awful for us if they didn't allow earlier visits with this, but in reality, look at how many guys who had great senior years who would be ours for the picking. So many guys that were under ranked as juniors would be wide open, because so many of the top recruiting schools would have near full recruiting classes.

 
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