Racism - It's a real thing.

[knapplc]

Then you will never learn in my opinion and we can agree to disagree.

Society is setup with systemic racist policies (gerrymandering, gentrification programs, etc) and we vote folks into office that perpetuate the problem.  We're partially at fault because of this cycle.

If you don't think you're a part of society and thus part of systemic racism...awesome...and let me know how you're able to exist separately so that I can do it as well.

I vote against gerrymandering politicians and those who push gender & racial inequalities. At the same time, I don't feel inherently guilty of systemic racism because I'm White. 

Those are not mutually exclusive things. I'm not perpetuating these problems, I'm actively trying to overcome them. 

 

[BigRedBuster]

Then you will never learn in my opinion and we can agree to disagree.

Society is setup with systemic racist policies (gerrymandering, gentrification programs, etc) and we vote folks into office that perpetuate the problem.  We're partially at fault because of this cycle.

If you don't think you're a part of society and thus part of systemic racism...awesome...and let me know how you're able to exist separately so that I can do it as well.

I support politicians that fight against the things you listed here.  Those things don't have anything to do with what is written on the back of that truck.  I didn't write it.  I don't support it.  I will speak out against it any time I am given a chance.  My kids are taught to do the same.

I am not the same as the guy in the truck and you trying to say that I should feel guilty because I live in Nebraska and so does that guy, is just flat out idiotic.  The sign on his truck is not systemic racism.  It's flat out individual racism from one person and the people around him that actively have supported him being that racist.  That's not me nor is it the majority of Nebraskans.

You're still part of a society that gives you or someone you know privileges due to their race.

The sign on the back of this truck is not systemic racism that I'm supposedly a part of.

This is an attitude that just leaves me not able to support so many liberal talking points.  I don't need to feel guilty about this.  I actively speak and fight against this attitude any time I can.  I don't understand the need for everyone to feel guilty because there's disgusting idiots in the world.

 

[knapplc]

You're still part of a society that gives you or someone you know privileges due to their race.

Acknowledging that and moving forward is pretty simple to do.  I'm not saying anyone or everyone is a racist...I'm saying arguing about who Gabrielle Union was targeting showed how people weren't comfortable with understanding racism in society and how people benefit or suffer due to it.

People feeling personally insulted at what she said was the wrong flex in my opinion...and it shows how fragile people's ego's are at the thought of being even a mild participant of racism whether directly or indirectly.

I think there's room for both conversations. Certainly one has more merit than the other, but as a Lincolnite and a White person I can be off-put by a label cast over all Lincolnites (for the sake of argument - I don't think that's what she's saying). 

At the same time I can do what's in my power to combat racism in any form. I can do both of these things at the same time and still be on the right side of the greater moral good. 

 

[Enhance]

I'm saying arguing about who Gabrielle Union was targeting showed how people weren't comfortable with understanding racism in society and how people benefit or suffer due to it.

I disagree.

I actively fight back against the kind of language and behavior that was on that man's truck. I disowned a member of my family and have not spoken to him in seven years because of his racist and homophobic beliefs (despite much of my family still choosing to remain in contact).

I simultaneously think GU's tweet dealt in absolutes and is the wrong way to approach these kind of discussions. I can do both of these things. I don't think it's fair to throw around banal accusations of that being about 'privilege.' Perhaps that's true in some peoples' cases but not all.

 

[knapplc]

So, this is interesting...

 

[Enhance]

We can agree to disagree...however, Banal accusations?

So you find this boring?  You find the fact that societal racism exists and that people who aren't minorities benefit from them to be boring and unoriginal?

Gonna give you the benefit of the doubt and say that you didn't mean banal there.

No, I said the accusation of this being about privilege was banal. I did not say what you are purporting me to have said.

 

[BigRedBuster]

Amazing that you made that leap.  I never said you were like the guy in the truck and I sure as hell never said you should feel guilty because you live in Nebraska.  I said I FEEL GUILTY of what she said in Florida as well.  Not sure how you came to these conclusions but you're making some broad assumptions and not actually reading what I said.

Once again, I wasn't talking about the guy or his sign, I was speaking about the reaction to Gabrielle Unions tweet.  Can you try to stay on topic instead of derail things?

Well, it's interesting because both Knapp and I took the conversation the same way.

So...let's review.

Racist dirt bag writes crap on his pickup.

G. Union writes tweet talking about racism in Lincoln.

You take the opportunity (because what dip s#!t wrote and GU's tweet) to express that you even feel guilty living in Florida because of systemic racism.  

I said I'm pissed about the dip s#!t and what he wrote, but I don't feel the need to feel guilty.

So....you are the one that jumped the conversation to something it wasn't.  The conversation was about a racist dip s#!t and GU's tweet about that.  You then took it to...."

Plenty of privilege with the discussion.  Instead of taking ownership of the racism that's in society which we are a part of, we're attempting to discuss why her tweet doesn't apply to us as individuals.

I own and acknowledge that she's right and that if I lived in Lincoln, I'd be one of the ones she is talking about. Even though I'm in Florida, I accept her blame and I vow to move forward to help fix the problem.  Pretty easy to admit I'm wrong and try to move forward...not sure why everyone tries to fight against it.

Now, if only everyone in this thread and the outside world would do that, we'd have a solution to problems.

What does it really do to everyone here if you're guilty of having a white privilege in a systemically racist society?  The answer is nothing...acknowledging a problem and and pledging yourself to fix it is part of moving forward.

Now.....I'm not sure how I'm supposed to take your post other than....I'm supposed to feel guilty because I live in a society that has systemic racism.  Which....wasn't being discussed till you brought it up.

 

[Danny Bateman]

The greater issue here is the racist d-bag, no doubt. But on that there's very little to discuss. No one here is pushing back on the idea that he's a racist liar, and we all unequivocally denounce him and what he did. So... what kind of conversation should we have on that track?

There's nuance to the Gabrielle Union tweet, and nuance is always going to generate discussion. Maybe there's a bit of privilege going on with that discussion, or maybe it's just the fact that we can walk & chew gum at the same time.

This hasn't been my experience, personally. By far and away, most of the reaction and feedback I've seen is in relation to the racist remarks, how disappointing they are, whether or not he's lying about how it got on his truck, etc. But as knapplc said, there's no way to misinterpret that element of the discussion - it was incredibly, and inherently, racist.

I guess my question (for discussion purposes) would be... why do we allow these discussions to delve into absolutes, as GU's tweet intentionally/unintentionally did? This racist d-hole with the truck is making a racist statement in absolute terms. GU's tweet was stating an absolute in relation to the people of Nebraska/Lincoln. Is that a fair way to respond to something like this?

Part of my views on this are shaped from not being in the homeland anymore. I can't give an accurate indicator of what conversation folks are having locally. So my perception is based on the reax from both the local and national personalities on Twitter. Personally I've got no desire to be on Facebook anymore and can only imagine what wonderful discussions this generated on there. So I'm sure my view is skewed a bit.

Union's tweet did make a negative generalization about Lincolnites, which I personally interpreted as angry snark. I don't think Truck Guy is emblematic of Lincoln at all, so I don't think it's an accurate generalization. But I think her response is one born of the historical plight of black people in America. And I get the impulse to react to this type of stuff with anger and indignation against that backdrop.

This doesn't affect me personally as a young white dude. I'm much less predisposed to have a strong emotional reaction to it as such. I merely thought it was interesting to see a significant chunk of (white) people being combative and seeming to take personal offense at the implication people were throwing all of Lincoln under the bus because of Truck Guy's behavior rather than the behavior itself.

 

[knapplc]

Yep, doesn't really change anything in my opinion sorry.

This does not seem like you're trying to have a good-faith conversation. @Enhance's post was very clear, and you're taking this in a weird direction.

 

[BigRedBuster]

Racism and racist policies aren't about conservative or liberal...you can be either and still be racist.

You don't have to feel guilty at all btw...acknowledging that a problem exists in society and is perpetuated by systemic constructs in society isn't about your feelings.

Great...I agree.

But....I have no clue what this has to do with this conversation about dip s#!t's truck and GU's tweet.  Neither one of them have to anything to do with systemic racism.  It's flat out a racist piece of s#!t and she tweeted about him.  

This quote from your post implies that we are all wrong for acknowledging that we are not a part of what he wrote on his truck....thus....not who GU was tweeting about either.

Plenty of privilege with the discussion.  Instead of taking ownership of the racism that's in society which we are a part of, we're attempting to discuss why her tweet doesn't apply to us as individuals.

Your post oozes the implication that we all should feel bad because we live in a society where there are pieces of s#!t like this and somehow, we are part of the problem.  

No....I don't support this and I can't remember a time in my life when I did.

 

[BigRedBuster]

all I can do is present it logically

Maybe you need to rethink how you're doing this.

 

[knapplc]

Actually I am...I can disagree and stat that my opinion is not swayed and that I still feel that banal was the wrong word to use.

He literally said the accusation you made is banal, and you're twisting that into this:

You find the fact that societal racism exists and that people who aren't minorities benefit from them to be boring and unoriginal?

It is clear to everyone in this thread that he did not say or imply that. 

That's bad faith. Be better than that.

 

[Enhance]

Yep, doesn't really change anything in my opinion sorry.

There's no need to apologize. I simply don't understand what you're trying to say.

I think it's lazy/boring to accuse those criticizing GU's tweet of doing so out of privilege. You somehow interpreted this as me saying 'the fact that societal racism exists and that people who aren't minorities benefit from them is boring and unoriginal' In a literal sense, that is not at all what I said or what was implied. Adjectives modify nouns. In this case, banal modified 'accusation,' and NOT the overall conversation about racism.

I'm not trying to be a smart a$$, but that was an extremely disingenuous interpretation of what I said and not at all an honest approach to this conversation.

 

[BigRedBuster]

This doesn't affect me personally as a young white dude. I'm much less predisposed to have a strong emotional reaction to it as such. I merely thought it was interesting to see a significant chunk of (white) people being combative and seeming to take personal offense at the implication people were throwing all of Lincoln under the bus because of Truck Guy's behavior than the behavior itself.

Here's the crux of my issues with your arguments here.

Truck guy writes racist crap on truck.

Almost everyone on social media (especially on this board) speak out against it and are upset that it paints Lincoln in a bad light light.

You're ruction..."Gee....look at all the white people trying to act righteous and trying to distance themselves from this idiot".

Here's the problem.  As a white guy, it's a no win situation.  I can not write anything here that will satisfy people from your thought process.  I have written many times how I am totally against this idiot and everything he stands for.  But...somehow....that's being "combative" and how I seemingly take personal office to how this makes Lincoln and Nebraska look.  

Pssst....HELL YES, I'm pissed about how this makes Nebraska look.  Why shouldn't I be?

 

[knapplc]

This is a great reminder that when someone shows you who they are, you should believe them.