** Scott Frost megathread all things SF***

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brophog said:
Lets call it what it is, indeed, by not calling it a spread offense, or pro style, or even "power". These are just dumb descriptors that have no place in an actual football conversation, and because they are poor descriptors, when people try to debate them it just gets messy like this because nobody bothered to properly define them in the first place.
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I like the discussions you bring to the board, but if you're going to say "don't use these descriptors", you have to propose an alternative. How can we talk about offenses and offensive philosophies if we can't even categorize them?

 
RedDenver said:
I like the discussions you bring to the board, but if you're going to say "don't use these descriptors", you have to propose an alternative. How can we talk about offenses and offensive philosophies if we can't even categorize them?
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I have proposed an alternative, many times. Call it what it is, and avoid categorizing them. 

It's formation, sets, personnel groups, and plays. They run weak side counter primarily out of trips, with 10 personnel from the shotgun. That tells me what it is.

They run "spread" doesn't.

 
Yep, you read that right.  No fullbacks.  Instead, Frost is a 10/11 personnel guy who likes 3 or more WRs in the game almost all the time.  And unlike what we’ve seen from Nebraska since 2015, Frost isn’t afraid to go Empty quite a bit with 5 players lined up as receivers:

Frost-Empty.png


Now, don’t leave me just yet Run the Damn Ball Guy.  Frost, despite his affinity for personnel groupings omitting the fullback, likes to spread the ball to run it.  UCF ran the ball 42 times for 247 yards (5.9 YPC) against Navy, and that’s pretty consistent with their season totals too (196 rushes, 144 passes heading into the Navy game). 

This is also my preferred approach to college football.  Formation defenses into a light box, get an athletic RB, and then let him work in a lot of open space.  It worked for Baylor, it worked for Oregon, and now it’s working for Frost at UCF as well.  There is no point in going heavy and bringing extra defenders into the box.  It’s just another guy there to make a tackle if you miss a block.  Instead, go light, move that defender to the perimeter, and then you don’t really have to block him in the first place.

https://huskerchalktalk.com/2017/10/22/lets-talk-scott-frost/
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brophog said:
I have proposed an alternative, many times. Call it what it is, and avoid categorizing them. 

It's formation, sets, personnel groups, and plays. They run weak side counter primarily out of trips, with 10 personnel from the shotgun. That tells me what it is.

They run "spread" doesn't.
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How does "They run weak side counter primarily out of trips, with 10 personnel from the shotgun." describe an offense or offensive philosophy? It's a single play-call. Unless that's the only play they run (or run a LOT), then that isn't a description of the offense but instead of an element that makes up an offense. It'd be like me asking you what kind of car you have, and you describing the muffler. That tells me something (e.g. it's not electric if it has a muffler) but doesn't answer the question.

Back to my original question: What makes Frost's offense "power spread" as some have claimed?

 
Spread out the defense with a downhill running game and a vertical passing game is what I like that still uses the option concepts. 

I'm a HUGE fan of the Coach Frost offense. It is far easier to recruit to the system that Coach Frost runs than what Coach Riley runs. In the Frost system you don't have to decline an offer to a kid that is 5'8'' burner because he lacks size. In the Coach Frost offense he would be a highlight reel (if the kid is legit). 

Spielman would be a dominant player on the Coach Frost system. 

 
RedDenver said:
How does "They run weak side counter primarily out of trips, with 10 personnel from the shotgun." describe an offense or offensive philosophy? It's a single play-call. Unless that's the only play they run (or run a LOT), then that isn't a description of the offense but instead of an element that makes up an offense. It'd be like me asking you what kind of car you have, and you describing the muffler. That tells me something (e.g. it's not electric if it has a muffler) but doesn't answer the question.
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If you don't do it that way then things will appear to have so much hybridization that they become indistinct.

What most people end up doing by using a word like "spread" is describing every car as having 4 wheels.

I can list the play types and passing concepts a specific coach runs. If you want to fit entire modern offenses into categories, though, I'm afraid I can't answer that. That's why these debates get messy.

 
brophog said:
If you don't do it that way then things will appear to have so much hybridization that they become indistinct.

What most people end up doing by using a word like "spread" is describing every car as having 4 wheels.

I can list the play types and passing concepts a specific coach runs. If you want to fit entire modern offenses into categories, though, I'm afraid I can't answer that. That's why these debates get messy.
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So how would you describe Frost's offense?

 
jessica0 said:
Spread out the defense with a downhill running game and a vertical passing game is what I like that still uses the option concepts. 

I'm a HUGE fan of the Coach Frost offense. It is far easier to recruit to the system that Coach Frost runs than what Coach Riley runs. In the Frost system you don't have to decline an offer to a kid that is 5'8'' burner because he lacks size. In the Coach Frost offense he would be a highlight reel (if the kid is legit). 

Spielman would be a dominant player on the Coach Frost system. 
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How about Tyjon?  

 
RedDenver said:
How does "They run weak side counter primarily out of trips, with 10 personnel from the shotgun." describe an offense or offensive philosophy? It's a single play-call. Unless that's the only play they run (or run a LOT), then that isn't a description of the offense but instead of an element that makes up an offense. It'd be like me asking you what kind of car you have, and you describing the muffler. That tells me something (e.g. it's not electric if it has a muffler) but doesn't answer the question.

Back to my original question: What makes Frost's offense "power spread" as some have claimed?
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He uses downhill blocking schemes and pulls more than Nebraska does. He doesn't have everything zone blocking. In the big picture, more spacing and slicing and dicing. 

 
jessica0 said:
Spread out the defense with a downhill running game and a vertical passing game is what I like that still uses the option concepts. 

I'm a HUGE fan of the Coach Frost offense. It is far easier to recruit to the system that Coach Frost runs than what Coach Riley runs. In the Frost system you don't have to decline an offer to a kid that is 5'8'' burner because he lacks size. In the Coach Frost offense he would be a highlight reel (if the kid is legit). 

Spielman would be a dominant player on the Coach Frost system. 
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You are right, just like the little speedster type guys at Oregon were high light reels, IE De'Anthony Thomas. Apparently under Riley's offense our 5'8 WRs are used as the main target traditional WR possessions, that isn't going to work in the B1G.

However, you utilize like DPE, Spielman like Frost and Oregon did with Thomas and Nelson and you have a truly special positional player. I thought when Riley saw DPE and seeing D-Thomas at Oregon for so many years he'd see the resemblance and use DPE like the Ducks did Thomas, but apparently not.

 
It is really a shame I want this season to be over so badly. I live for college football, but have lost all faith for this season and am just ready to move on. Wish tomorrows headline read: Riley to step down after this season, Frost named head coach of Nebraska for 2018.

 
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