Tangent Thread - Run the Damn Ball!!!

runningblind said:
That's just not true. We don't need a Heisman finalist at QB to succeed, just a guy who can make most of the throws and make good decisions. Adrian was that easily with some improved decision making.  That is a good philosophy for most any college football team.  Folks keep saying "throwing the ball is the problem!". No people, some terrible administrative decisons and some poor coaches have been the problem,  Scott Frost included so far.

Your second comment tells me you're still comparing everything to the 90s and literally nothing is the same anymore across college football.  It WAS a demonstrable fact, but is not any longer. That era is never coming back and fans would do well to move on. 
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Our unique inability to recruit top passing QBs is as real now as it was in the 90s. 

 
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The Dude said:
That's the thing with passing the ball all the time.  You put up tons of yards, and you lose tons of games. 

Tom Osborne said it best.  Rushing yards are more valuable than passing yards. 

300 yards passing is impressive until calculate in the 3 interceptions that lost you the game.
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And the 300 yards are mostly in between the 20 yard lines.  It’s always been tough to score in the red zone thru the air, especially when you have a run as a last resort - now and then - ground game.  Basically we have no power game, all finesse and guesswork play sequencing.  
 

Football is, at its essence, a battle will power and fierce determination to be tougher and play harder than your opponent.   Frost and Whipple can modify his offense to incorporate a meaningful blend of the most effective passing elements with any of a variety of honest running plays.   Go under center some.  Add a 2nd RB. A second TE.  Show power run and then power run it some.  If he would add a dozen more RB carries, and cut the passes by ten, it’s quite likely he will add 4 more first downs and 10 points scoring.  And the defense won’t be playing with their backs against the wall.   Real yardage balance.  And good chance that passing game improves as defenses will have defend the run.  

 
84HuskerLaw said:
And the 300 yards are mostly in between the 20 yard lines.  It’s always been tough to score in the red zone thru the air, especially when you have a run as a last resort - now and then - ground game.  Basically we have no power game, all finesse and guesswork play sequencing.  
 

Football is, at its essence, a battle will power and fierce determination to be tougher and play harder than your opponent.   Frost and Whipple can modify his offense to incorporate a meaningful blend of the most effective passing elements with any of a variety of honest running plays.   Go under center some.  Add a 2nd RB. A second TE.  Show power run and then power run it some.  If he would add a dozen more RB carries, and cut the passes by ten, it’s quite likely he will add 4 more first downs and 10 points scoring.  And the defense won’t be playing with their backs against the wall.   Real yardage balance.  And good chance that passing game improves as defenses will have defend the run.  
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You keep throwing out these statistics which will happen if NU runs the ball more without real facts. Looking at the top 20 scoring offenses in the country, only 2 of them (Coastal Carolina and Michigan) are "yardage balanced" as you would like to see.

NU's offense does need to improve its scoring output, but that won't be done by running the ball more and throwing it less. Where NU will improve its scoring output is to get better and run the ball more with the I-backs (taking carries away from the QB) and being more efficient in the passing game (better TD-INT ratio). That's how NU will add 7-10 points per game on offense. 

 
I never cited statistics.  I gave numbers based of 50 years of football observation and understanding.  They are projections based on how football works.  Period.  
 

Your idea of simply doing more of the same appears to match Frost’s idea, until Frost realized 3-9 after three previous losing seasons is NOT working and won’t work in the future.  
You agree with me  and are correct to suggest more RB carries and fewer QB runs, especially if we don’t replace Adrian with a good runner.  I said the same thing.  More yards got to come from the RBs , not just carries to keep the defense honest and allow the passing aspects to work well.  You must avoid being one-dimensional (yardage production more than snap count).  You can win without passing much but very rarely do the opposite against sound defenses (big ten especially).  
 

In many respects, Frost’s approach to offense is the polar opposite of Osborne.  Frost wants to run now and then when teams overplay the pass.  Osborne passed when defenses overplayed the run to the point of stopping it.  
 

The problem is it is more difficult to run your way to a first down on 3rd and long vs pass.  Osborne threw when he had to or when the defense made it easy.  Frost seems to have every intent, interest and desire to pass pass pass and run from a passing formation without numbers advantage, as a sort surprise play. The defense expect us to throw and don’t much worry about a handful of carries by RB.  Adrian was about our best rusher at 60 yrds a game roughly.  Our passing game at 63% with a revolving door of 20 - 4 star type speedy WRs and good TEs.   After 4 years and looking at the numbers across cfb generally, our pass game isn’t getting much better, statistically, by changing the guy who signals in the play from Frost.  The ratios and run/pass mix and sequencing got to change.   As many AM backers correctly point out, his stats are good, everywhere but int to TDs, fumbles, and wins and losses.  Adrian is an above average Big Ten talent QB.  Probably better than 90% of the unhappy QBs flooding the portal right now.  Frost has insisted Adrian is far better than a dozen or so QBs he and Riley have recruited the past 5 years.  Now Frost is again searching high and low for more QBs because the guys he has hand selected as the next AM only somehow better apparently don’t pass muster.  Revolving door in the QB room as well as the WR and RBs.  ???    This AINT working and AINT gonna.  
 

 
84HuskerLaw said:
I never cited statistics.  I gave numbers based of 50 years of football observation and understanding.  They are projections based on how football works.  Period.  
 

Your idea of simply doing more of the same appears to match Frost’s idea, until Frost realized 3-9 after three previous losing seasons is NOT working and won’t work in the future.  
You agree with me  and are correct to suggest more RB carries and fewer QB runs, especially if we don’t replace Adrian with a good runner.  I said the same thing.  More yards got to come from the RBs , not just carries to keep the defense honest and allow the passing aspects to work well.  You must avoid being one-dimensional (yardage production more than snap count).  You can win without passing much but very rarely do the opposite against sound defenses (big ten especially).  
 

In many respects, Frost’s approach to offense is the polar opposite of Osborne.  Frost wants to run now and then when teams overplay the pass.  Osborne passed when defenses overplayed the run to the point of stopping it.  
 

The problem is it is more difficult to run your way to a first down on 3rd and long vs pass.  Osborne threw when he had to or when the defense made it easy.  Frost seems to have every intent, interest and desire to pass pass pass and run from a passing formation without numbers advantage, as a sort surprise play. The defense expect us to throw and don’t much worry about a handful of carries by RB.  Adrian was about our best rusher at 60 yrds a game roughly.  Our passing game at 63% with a revolving door of 20 - 4 star type speedy WRs and good TEs.   After 4 years and looking at the numbers across cfb generally, our pass game isn’t getting much better, statistically, by changing the guy who signals in the play from Frost.  The ratios and run/pass mix and sequencing got to change.   As many AM backers correctly point out, his stats are good, everywhere but int to TDs, fumbles, and wins and losses.  Adrian is an above average Big Ten talent QB.  Probably better than 90% of the unhappy QBs flooding the portal right now.  Frost has insisted Adrian is far better than a dozen or so QBs he and Riley have recruited the past 5 years.  Now Frost is again searching high and low for more QBs because the guys he has hand selected as the next AM only somehow better apparently don’t pass muster.  Revolving door in the QB room as well as the WR and RBs.  ???    This AINT working and AINT gonna.  
 
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are you like 70 or are you counting the year you were born as the start of your observations? 

 
84HuskerLaw said:
 If he would add a dozen more RB carries, and cut the passes by ten, it’s quite likely he will add 4 more first downs and 10 points scoring.
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Damn.  You seem to have figured it all out.

You should have told Frost this in the past offseason and we would have went 12-0.

 
Red Five said:
Damn.  You seem to have figured it all out.

You should have told Frost this in the past offseason and we would have went 12-0.
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I along with hundreds of thousands of other observers have been telling him.  He has not listened, apparently, until he was told either change things or find another job.  Whipple will try, if Frost will permit it, but recruiting doesn’t suggest power football, in any form or flavor, is the goal.  For example:  2 portal QBs plus Torres already to replace Adrian.  1 O linemen signed whose undersized to play next fall. 1 portal O lineman to replace his best lineman whose leaving early.  1 big TE to replace 1 leaving.  No FB on the roster in 4 years and none planned. No RB coach hired yet and no special teams coach named if he even wants one (???).  
His best coach hire is WRs coach.  O line hire may be OK but inexperienced.  A near retirement guy, albeit very experienced and I think knows football very well, is reputed to be a QBs guy in the passing game mostly.  
Where’s the run game and blocking focus in the changes?   Not very prominent certainly.  This does not reassure many observers.  

The most positive thing, so far, is the transfer portal is not filling with too many current Huskers.  I hope this holds.  There are some ‘misses’ across the team but to recruit well, players need to trust the HC to be honorable, honest and a promise keeper.  Frost has done this, mostly, but many calls in this board to run guys off, nudge ‘em out, etc.  We’ve had too many leave already.   

 
There is only one statistic that matters. W/L. We went 3-9, and if you're a football guy at all, you know DANG WELL, we are what our record shows. 

Here's a stat. The last 4 years, Nebraska has averaged 23 points per game vs FBS teams with this style of offense. THAT ain't gonna cut the mustard. 

It's simple. We can’t recruit the kind of athlete needed to beat other teams like this. We aren't going to out-athlete people for touchdowns. Never has happened, never will. 

Nebraska had only ever found success by patiently working the ball down the field, through sheer force of will. It was about lining up and pushing the guy across from you around. Get them crowding the line, and loft one over their head. 

This is not rocket science, but we've been treating it that way for decades now. What's wrong with being a power-run team? Why is everyone so averse to the idea? Are you afraid we'll suck?

You know what REALLY sucks?

Going 3-9 and 5 STRAIGHT YEARS WITHOUT A BOWL. 

 
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Jeremy said:
There is only one statistic that matters. W/L. We went 3-9, and if you're a football guy at all, you know DANG WELL, we are what our record shows. 

Here's a stat. The last 4 years, Nebraska has averaged 23 points per game vs FBS teams with this style of offense. THAT ain't gonna cut the mustard. 

It's simple. We can’t recruit the kind of athlete needed to beat other teams like this. We aren't going to out-athlete people for touchdowns. Never has happened, never will. 

Nebraska had only ever found success by patiently working the ball down the field, through sheer force of will. It was about lining up and pushing the guy across from you around. Get them crowding the line, and loft one over their head. 

This is not rocket science, but we've been treating it that way for decades now. What's wrong with being a power-run team? Why is everyone so averse to the idea? Are you afraid we'll suck?

You know what REALLY sucks?

Going 3-9 and 5 STRAIGHT YEARS WITHOUT A BOWL. 
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I agree that 3-9 sucks, as does 5 straight years without a bowl. But, you are wrong in that the best NU offenses patiently worked the way down the field. The best NU offenses of the past were quick strike offenses with getting the ball outside to track stars as I-backs and quarterbacks, or fooling the defense with a deep play action pass. Yes, NU had a power running offense, but it the best success was not due to matriculating the ball down the field, it succeeded because of big plays. 

 
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ColoradoHusk said:
I agree that 3-9 sucks, as does 5 straight years without a bowl. But, you are wrong in that the best NU offenses patiently worked the way down the field. The best NU offenses of the past were quick strike offenses with getting the ball outside to track stars as I-backs and quarterbacks, or fooling the defense with a deep play action pass. Yes, NU had a power running offense, but it the best success was not due to matriculating the ball down the field, it succeeded because of big plays. 
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True, I'll grant you all that. We did get some real athletes at I-back, and I've said we'll always be able to recruit that kind of kid. We got the best RB out of Minnesota recently. 

But I mentioned the PA pass - the ONLY way it works is if you set it up with a solid running game. 

I still contend, however, that both Devaney and Osborne were 'grind-it-out' coaches, both criticized at times for being too conservative, and running the ball too much. Shatel was almost a broken record in the late 80s and early 90s describing Osborne's playcalling as methodical and boring.

They did have a lot of big plays, but they were set up by the plethora of little ones before. For instance, we'd get them on a counter for 30+ after Osborne called several FB dives and traps for minimal gains. 

What you're saying also just goes further to prove my point. We have been successful running the ball, and we can do it again. 

 
84HuskerLaw said:
I along with hundreds of thousands of other observers have been telling him.  He has not listened, apparently, until he was told either change things or find another job.  Whipple will try, if Frost will permit it, but recruiting doesn’t suggest power football, in any form or flavor, is the goal.  For example:  2 portal QBs plus Torres already to replace Adrian.  1 O linemen signed whose undersized to play next fall. 1 portal O lineman to replace his best lineman whose leaving early.  1 big TE to replace 1 leaving.  No FB on the roster in 4 years and none planned. No RB coach hired yet and no special teams coach named if he even wants one (???).  
His best coach hire is WRs coach.  O line hire may be OK but inexperienced.  A near retirement guy, albeit very experienced and I think knows football very well, is reputed to be a QBs guy in the passing game mostly.  
Where’s the run game and blocking focus in the changes?   Not very prominent certainly.  This does not reassure many observers.  

The most positive thing, so far, is the transfer portal is not filling with too many current Huskers.  I hope this holds.  There are some ‘misses’ across the team but to recruit well, players need to trust the HC to be honorable, honest and a promise keeper.  Frost has done this, mostly, but many calls in this board to run guys off, nudge ‘em out, etc.  We’ve had too many leave already.   
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If you are waiting for Whipple to come in and run the ball with a power look, you will be waiting for awhile. History says Whipple will almost be 60-40 pass, which is more pass than what SF had been I believe.

 
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