The Nebraska Way

[cm husker]

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

I think you missed what CM said - he only speaks FACTS

There's an irony in you calling me out while we are still waiting for a link to the "fact" that TO hid a gun for Muhammad.

he hid the gun for Williams. Muhammad had the bullet in his buttcheek.

Why are you correcting me when Saber (and now you) is the one stating an false information about these cases?

 

[Count 'Bility]

Once we get over this notion that our winning way is so much more special and unique than anyother, that's when we'll truly have a Nebraska way.

I used to be like you. I lived during the 90's. My hard attention began right at about 1991. Pretty damn convenient right? My childhood being that of nothing but success? Then these harder times hit. Firing coaches with wining records. and I see this nebraska way being brought up. So i started thinking. What is it? And the more I think, and see everything going on, and analyzing all that has happened in the past and the what coulda beens had we lost a game or two extra here and there, or won an extra game here and there, tells me that the Nebraska Way is nothing more than just the winning way. it's really that simple.

This is my post from the other thread.......

Thats what you want to believe it means. And you can bet your a$$, that had Osborne never won titles, there wouldntve been all this "back to Nebraska way" stuff. And had Callahan or Bo won some sort of championship, it wouldve been restored in the blink of an eye. Winning. That's all it is. Just winning. We like to think as a fanbase we've won in some unique way. Like we took a harder road than most. Running game. Walk-ons, etc. When it's probably the exact opposite. We used those things cuz they were the best fit for us to make winning easiest. Running a program and cheering for a program is not stoic or special. it goes on everywhere. in every sport. You win, you get to keep going. you lose, youre out and we go in another direction. i think we're a bit blinded by the fact that we had the same coach for 25 years with consistent results, and think everything was alway hunky dory, and use that to legitimize this fictional Nebraska Way. When in fact, it wasnt always hunky dory, and on more than one occasion, that so called Nebraska Way almost died long before the Nebraska Way actually became what it is now perceived to be. If Osborne loses the Liberty bowl and gets fired, leaves for Colorado, or steps aside after 1990, and Nebraska doesnt win to nearly the tick that they did, then there is no Nebraska Way.

And yes, CM I have read Scott Frost's commentary on this. Ive read more books and watched more documentaries on Epply, Stark, Osborne, Devaney etc. to make your head spin. I could pamper you with more history and info of the top of my head that make you go crosseyes. But here's the great thing about humanity. Frost doesnt speak for me. I can develop my own opinion. And I have the confidenece and arrogance that my opinion is right. And Frost is another interesting cog in the Nebraska way discussion. The savior. The gold child. The one who didnt want to be here to begin with. That only came back cuz he figured out fit. And probably one who has no interest in returning.

These values you describe are winning values. They were established as tools to win. Devaney and Osborne, while revered as angels, were competitive sonsabitches. They werent doing some holier than thow methods to make everyone feel good. They were doing things that fit and could win. Its just a concept I look at from afar thinking we're really not anymore unique than anyone else who wants to win. And these last 15 years have finally exposed that. It's a concept that was manufactured by 40 years of consistency and a blind assumption that it was ALWAYS great.

Was there a point in all this?

You dont agree. So you didnt read it. You didnt think about it. Youre hardstanced on your opinion. And that's fine. So you attack mine with the classic "what's youre point". its a classic response to something that requires thought, or demands thought, but yet, isnt convenient to your own opinion. I get it.

 

[knapplc]

Would all of you people citing "the police report" of the Lawrence Phillips incident kindly post screen grabs of the report, or links to the report?

 

[cm husker]

Kate McEwen did not make a plea that Lawrence Philips should be allowed back on the team. The University offered her round-the-clock protection in the wake of Phillips' attack. She left Nebraska after we failed to honor her scholarship.

Because she "didn't show progress in her basketball abilities."

I wonder what circumstances might have gotten in the way of her succeeding...

That was an editorialization in the article you're referring to. Not a quote from the team. And, I thought that she finished her academic career at NU (will need to verify that). Personally, I think her schollie should have been renewed, because I don't believe in pulling a scholarship from any athlete who is academically eligible and has not broken team rules.

Quote from the article:

Angela Beck, the coach of the Nebraska women's team, said yesterday that she had told McEwen recently that her athletic scholarship would not continue because of a lack of progress in her play.

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1996/Assault-Victim-Kate-McEwen-Won-t-Play-at-Nebraska/id-98264b2c093e4e04d0678f27b53e9894

Here's a more complete article, with a quote from McEwen:

Kate McEwen, who gained national attention as the victim of football star Lawrence Phillips' assault last fall, said she will not return to the Nebraska women's basketball team, although she has two years of eligibility remaining.

McEwen, a 5-foot-8 guard, told Nebraska women's coach Angela Beck, however, that she will stay in school.

``She said she had no hard feelings with the basketball program,'' Beck told the Omaha World-Herald from Lincoln. ``She likes the program but she doesn't have any desire to play this year. She wants to focus on her degree and graduate in May.''

McEwen played in six games as a freshman after back surgery, was granted a medical hardship and played as a reserve in 22 games during the 1994-95 season, averaging less than a rebound and point per game.

Phillips admitted to assaulting McEwen last fall, resulting in a multi-game suspension from the Nebraska football team. Phillips returned for a standout performance in the Fiesta Bowl, and was a first-round NFL draft pick by the St. Louis Rams.

His probation sentence for the assault is scheduled to end Nov. 29.

Beck said McEwen had thought through the decision. ``She's looking forward to having a good year and getting her focus back on her grades,'' the coach said. ``She seems to be her old self.''

In a statement released through the sports information office, McEwen said, ``I have made a decision to remain at the University of Nebraska and complete my degree next season. And although I will no longer play basketball, I will continue to support the team and the program.''

And the article discussing that McEwen and her attorney wanted him reinstated: http://www.dailynebraskan.com/news-phillips-mcewen-reach-settlement-in-suit-phillips/article_15cb54ef-188c-5724-aa1b-73804565ff30.html

 

[Mavric]

For the record, I never stated he should have been kicked off the team. I said TO handled it wrong.

I've generally agreed with you on this situation but I'm curious about this comment. LP only played one more game at Nebraska. So about the only thing to do differently would have been to kick him off the team.

He played more than just one game. He was suspended after game 2. He played 3 more including the NCG.

Here is what I felt should have happened if he wasn't going to be kicked off the team.

There was no need to let him play at all the rest of the year. Definitely no need to let him start the Fiesta Bowl. He could have been reinstated and been allowed to practice. and not participate in any games. If structure was truly what he needed, then he had it and wasn't going to be rewarded with playing time.

Gotcha. I had forgotten that he played some in the other games.

 

[cm husker]

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

I think you missed what CM said - he only speaks FACTS

There's an irony in you calling me out while we are still waiting for a link to the "fact" that TO hid a gun for Muhammad.

the si hit piece has a quote from osborne about the incident. and it was tyrone wiliams gun that steele and osborne hid.

In contrast to Saber, you at least seem to know some of the "facts" around that incident, like who was involved.

Now I recommend you look for the additional information that the prosecutor didn't release in his press statements.

Some of those facts will include that TO and his staff immediately notified police of the gun, kept it secure (didn't try to "hide" it or destroy it) and held it for only two days, turning it over immediately when a police officer came to retrieve it.

If you go only off of an SI article and Lacey's statements, I understand why you come away with the impression that TO obstructed justice.

But, one only has to ask: was he or his staff even investigated for, let alone charged with, obstruction or hiding evidence? The answer is a resounding no. AND, Williams was not guilty of the underlying crime allegedly involving the gun.

People need to stop believing that prosecutor press releases are gospel.

Taking Osborne's word for everything is great if you believe he has unimpeachable character. He's shown he doesn't, and therefore should be scrutinized heavily, as should his statements and actions.

When you treat coaches like infallible gods, taking their word only, you get situations like Art Briles and Joe Paterno. Those aren't mistakes I'd like to see replicated at Nebraska. Stop putting coaches on pedestals, and start looking at them as they are. Use all the facts.

I'm not taking Osborne's word on everything.

Hiding a gun is a felony. Was TO, his staff or anyone else investigated - let alone charged with - this crime?

Or is it all a vast coverup that only a single prosecutor would air?

Paterno went 30 years letting some guy butt rape boys in the shower and never said anything and was never questioned. This is all the point Knapp is making. Your point on TO not being investigated or charged for this doesnt mean he shouldntve been and is absolved of all possible wrong doing. fact is, no one for sure really knows. This topic is like anything else. Opinion vs opinion.

So you're equating TO to Paterno.

This is sickening.

People aren't stating "TO hid a gun" as an opinion. They are stating it as fact.

 

[huskerfan2000]

So, I guess substantiated facts are only required by some and in the Politics & Religion forum.

 

[cm husker]

Would all of you people citing "the police report" of the Lawrence Phillips incident kindly post screen grabs of the report, or links to the report?

Who cited a police report?

 

[huskerfan2000]

Once we get over this notion that our winning way is so much more special and unique than anyother, that's when we'll truly have a Nebraska way.

I used to be like you. I lived during the 90's. My hard attention began right at about 1991. Pretty damn convenient right? My childhood being that of nothing but success? Then these harder times hit. Firing coaches with wining records. and I see this nebraska way being brought up. So i started thinking. What is it? And the more I think, and see everything going on, and analyzing all that has happened in the past and the what coulda beens had we lost a game or two extra here and there, or won an extra game here and there, tells me that the Nebraska Way is nothing more than just the winning way. it's really that simple.

This is my post from the other thread.......

Thats what you want to believe it means. And you can bet your a$$, that had Osborne never won titles, there wouldntve been all this "back to Nebraska way" stuff. And had Callahan or Bo won some sort of championship, it wouldve been restored in the blink of an eye. Winning. That's all it is. Just winning. We like to think as a fanbase we've won in some unique way. Like we took a harder road than most. Running game. Walk-ons, etc. When it's probably the exact opposite. We used those things cuz they were the best fit for us to make winning easiest. Running a program and cheering for a program is not stoic or special. it goes on everywhere. in every sport. You win, you get to keep going. you lose, youre out and we go in another direction. i think we're a bit blinded by the fact that we had the same coach for 25 years with consistent results, and think everything was alway hunky dory, and use that to legitimize this fictional Nebraska Way. When in fact, it wasnt always hunky dory, and on more than one occasion, that so called Nebraska Way almost died long before the Nebraska Way actually became what it is now perceived to be. If Osborne loses the Liberty bowl and gets fired, leaves for Colorado, or steps aside after 1990, and Nebraska doesnt win to nearly the tick that they did, then there is no Nebraska Way.

And yes, CM I have read Scott Frost's commentary on this. Ive read more books and watched more documentaries on Epply, Stark, Osborne, Devaney etc. to make your head spin. I could pamper you with more history and info of the top of my head that make you go crosseyes. But here's the great thing about humanity. Frost doesnt speak for me. I can develop my own opinion. And I have the confidenece and arrogance that my opinion is right. And Frost is another interesting cog in the Nebraska way discussion. The savior. The gold child. The one who didnt want to be here to begin with. That only came back cuz he figured out fit. And probably one who has no interest in returning.

These values you describe are winning values. They were established as tools to win. Devaney and Osborne, while revered as angels, were competitive sonsabitches. They werent doing some holier than thow methods to make everyone feel good. They were doing things that fit and could win. Its just a concept I look at from afar thinking we're really not anymore unique than anyone else who wants to win. And these last 15 years have finally exposed that. It's a concept that was manufactured by 40 years of consistency and a blind assumption that it was ALWAYS great.

Was there a point in all this?

I'm betting this posters chest is black and blue after beating it like that.

 

[StPaulHusker]

Kate McEwen did not make a plea that Lawrence Philips should be allowed back on the team. The University offered her round-the-clock protection in the wake of Phillips' attack. She left Nebraska after we failed to honor her scholarship.

Because she "didn't show progress in her basketball abilities."

I wonder what circumstances might have gotten in the way of her succeeding...

That was an editorialization in the article you're referring to. Not a quote from the team. And, I thought that she finished her academic career at NU (will need to verify that). Personally, I think her schollie should have been renewed, because I don't believe in pulling a scholarship from any athlete who is academically eligible and has not broken team rules.

Quote from the article:

Angela Beck, the coach of the Nebraska women's team, said yesterday that she had told McEwen recently that her athletic scholarship would not continue because of a lack of progress in her play.

http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1996/Assault-Victim-Kate-McEwen-Won-t-Play-at-Nebraska/id-98264b2c093e4e04d0678f27b53e9894

Here's a more complete article, with a quote from McEwen:

Kate McEwen, who gained national attention as the victim of football star Lawrence Phillips' assault last fall, said she will not return to the Nebraska women's basketball team, although she has two years of eligibility remaining.

McEwen, a 5-foot-8 guard, told Nebraska women's coach Angela Beck, however, that she will stay in school.

``She said she had no hard feelings with the basketball program,'' Beck told the Omaha World-Herald from Lincoln. ``She likes the program but she doesn't have any desire to play this year. She wants to focus on her degree and graduate in May.''

McEwen played in six games as a freshman after back surgery, was granted a medical hardship and played as a reserve in 22 games during the 1994-95 season, averaging less than a rebound and point per game.

Phillips admitted to assaulting McEwen last fall, resulting in a multi-game suspension from the Nebraska football team. Phillips returned for a standout performance in the Fiesta Bowl, and was a first-round NFL draft pick by the St. Louis Rams.

His probation sentence for the assault is scheduled to end Nov. 29.

Beck said McEwen had thought through the decision. ``She's looking forward to having a good year and getting her focus back on her grades,'' the coach said. ``She seems to be her old self.''

In a statement released through the sports information office, McEwen said, ``I have made a decision to remain at the University of Nebraska and complete my degree next season. And although I will no longer play basketball, I will continue to support the team and the program.''

And the article discussing that McEwen and her attorney wanted him reinstated: http://www.dailynebraskan.com/news-phillips-mcewen-reach-settlement-in-suit-phillips/article_15cb54ef-188c-5724-aa1b-73804565ff30.html

Nowhere in that last article is there a quote from the woman or the attorney claiming that they wanted him reinstated.

 

[The Dude]

Bob Devany would have drank Keith Williams under the table, the Nebraska way.

 

[knapplc]

Would all of you people citing "the police report" of the Lawrence Phillips incident kindly post screen grabs of the report, or links to the report?

Who cited a police report?

The "report" mentioned in post #66, for one.

 

[knapplc]

Maybe if Frost wasn't hiding in the closet while it all went down, he could've come to her aid.

But that's not what happened. A Washington Post article describes the incident:

Running back Lawrence Phillips, an early Heisman Trophy contender, was arrested Sunday after allegedly assaulting a 20-year-old former girlfriend. According to police records and witnesses who spoke to the Omaha World-Herald and the Daily Nebraskan, Kate McEwen, a sophomore guard on the Nebraska women's basketball team, was the subject of a tug-of-war between Phillips and backup quarterback Scott Frost.

Phillips and Frost each were pulling on her, and McEwen allegedly was dragged down several stairs and hit during the fracas.

 

[cm husker]

When someone states "he acted with no integrity" that implies a very specific thing about a person.

It's hard for that claim to hold up when many people, including the victim, thought he handled it in a reasonable way.

Does anyone think that TO kept LP on the team for selfish reasons? Does anyone think that TO kept LP on the team but would not have kept a less valuable player on the team for the same offense?

Yes answers to those questions would be evidence of a lack of integrity.

But no one, including those critical in this thread, have argued those were his motives for making what may be considered a wrong decision.

That's my central issue: People equate a wrong decision (and I'm not sure it was wrong) with a lack of integrity. That's fundamentally wrong to do.

St Paul and Knapp, do you think that Riley lacks integrity for how he handled the gang rape he was aware of?

 

[JJ Husker]

I'll argue as long as the day is that Osborne did what he did for LP because he thought it was best for LP and not because he thought it was best for Osborne or the team. And I think he would have done the same for a walkon running back.

Like it or not, that's integrity. If LP had used football to turn his life around, TO would have been lauded for giving him a second chance after a misdemeanor (his first, notably). It's only in hindsight that we say he made a major error.

As to Benning, and that's only as far as I got in that hit peace, he was 100% innocent. Not just "not guilty," he was innocent.

Makes me sick to see people buy into this crap.

Absolutely. +1000 if I could