Year 4 Expectations

Dr. Strangelove said:
The 2009 team was an extremely conservative offense. If you want to cherry pick numbers to exclude Virginia Tech, be my guest. But that 2009 team tried to get out of its own way on offense, happily punting the ball so Suh and Co. could take the field. 

I guess I'm blind to the development of our runningbacks recruited out of High School. Or the WRs that can't seem to find the field. Or the wins and losses. Or that Minnesota was down to 50 scholarship players. Or that Illinois did not blow us out at home and did not fire their head coach.

Yes, I'm making it all up to make Frost look bad. It's been refuted in the thread even! 
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What am I cherry picking?

My original quote- "The 157 points scored against Florida Atlantic, Arkansas State, Virginia Tech and Louisiana-Lafayette should surely be used to compare between the seasons..."

Here is the bottom line.  Your takes are over the top negative.  I get it, you don't like Frost and your ticked that we aren't better.  I argue back because I think it would be crazy to make a change right now.  We have been a revolving door for 20 years- That is not working.  Has this staff made mistakes?  Of course- that's obvious.  They have also made some significant improvements.  I think those lead to some pretty good teams in the next couple years.  If I'm wrong, good chance your point of view will be shared by a whole lot more people, including myself.  

 
J-MAGIC said:
Can you show me where I said that Frost doesn't deserve criticism or that the current state of our program is "all good"?? Because I have a lot of criticisms! I have done nothing here but push back on the narratives (a) that things are as bad as they've ever been, (b) that the team hasn't improved significantly under Frost, and (c) that our talent level/recruiting wasn't horrific under Riley -- using I think some fairly objective measures such as SP+, our recent NFL draft history, and rerankings of our recruiting classes by The Athletic. If you think that means I don't understand shades of gray or that I think everything is "all good", then I would question your reading comprehension.
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Maybe it was more Hilltop and TheSker, I felt like you were jumping on the sunshine bandwagon with that last statement to the doctor, fair enough.

J-MAGIC said:
I think the main disagreement here is coming down to, "How do we want to measure success/progress for a developing program?":

1. Pure binaries like wins/losses, other contextless numbers like points per game, recruiting rankings, etc.

2. What do the underlying numbers and advanced stats say? How do we actually look on the field? How tough was our schedule? Have we been lucky/unlucky?

I think subscribing to ONLY Option 1 is very dumb and the people who do so are going it are going to be proven very wrong. But if you want to just yell "12-20!" you're not wrong and no one can really stop you.
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Some subscribe to #1 only, but lots of us aren't.  I've said many times the defense is improving.  However, there comes a time when you can't just say we were the best 4-8 team out there with some great stats!  Gosh we are unlucky. For me it is year 4 when #2 doesn't hold water anymore if we end the year missing a bowl again you know?  I am not sure I will care at all next winter about next gen stats and SP+ being top 30 if we go 5-7 yet again no matter the schedule.

 
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Hilltop said:
What am I cherry picking?

My original quote- "The 157 points scored against Florida Atlantic, Arkansas State, Virginia Tech and Louisiana-Lafayette should surely be used to compare between the seasons..."

Here is the bottom line.  Your takes are over the top negative.  I get it, you don't like Frost and your ticked that we aren't better.  I argue back because I think it would be crazy to make a change right now.  We have been a revolving door for 20 years- That is not working.  Has this staff made mistakes?  Of course- that's obvious.  They have also made some significant improvements.  I think those lead to some pretty good teams in the next couple years.  If I'm wrong, good chance your point of view will be shared by a whole lot more people, including myself.  
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We all want the same thing: a team that wins and does so with integrity.  :cheers

 


How could a Big Ten team only have 11 players at 300 pounds or more? That is nuts. Now you know why Frost was saying the team was too small. Your typical OL starter in the Big Ten is around 6'5'' 320 pounds. 

 
runningblind said:
I understand what you both are saying.  However, the decision to run off a bunch of kids, tear the program down and bring in all of his guys was Frost's decision.  That is fine, and may turn out to the be the right one yet.  However, you don't get to hide behind inexperience if that was your own choice longer than a couple years.  That doesn't fly with me in year 4.  I need to see improvements in coaching during games, and I need to see wins to believe things are on the right track.  Otherwise we will be back here in a year with people spouting this same stuff about how year 5 is really year 2.  

I won't accept Nebraska football fans just making lists of excuses for years on end, that is flat out lame fellas.  We can look at the facts for sure, but the biggest fact is that if things aren't trending up significantly by year 4 no matter the situation prior we have a large problem on our hands still.  This is completely Frost's team now, with only Frost's guys and Frost's culture.  Riley can't be blamed for the mindset now, if it still sucks then that is on the current staff whether you like that or not.
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Yep....and I still support the decision to mostly over turn the roster the first couple years.  It was needed for all the reasons listed. I’m frustrated at the records the first three years.  But, looking at reality of the program isn’t just “listing excuses”.  It’s just how bad our program was.  Now, I’m surprised our record was as bad as it was this year.  I would have thought we would have been better on offense.  That needs to change next year and we need proof the offense is developing to what we need.  

 
BigRedBuster said:
Yep....and I still support the decision to mostly over turn the roster the first couple years.  It was needed for all the reasons listed. I’m frustrated at the records the first three years.  But, looking at reality of the program isn’t just “listing excuses”.  It’s just how bad our program was.  Now, I’m surprised our record was as bad as it was this year.  I would have thought we would have been better on offense.  That needs to change next year and we need proof the offense is developing to what we need.  
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Agreed.

I don't pay much attention to the "no excuses" posts...or holding Frost "accountable".  Those that have that kind of influence aren't posting on an internet message board 

I thought out record would be better also.  But the more time that goes by the more apparent it is that a few recruiting classes have simply not been good.....including Frost's first.

 
TheSker said:
Agreed.

I don't pay much attention to the "no excuses" posts...or holding Frost "accountable".  Those that have that kind of influence aren't posting on an internet message board 

I thought out record would be better also.  But the more time that goes by the more apparent it is that a few recruiting classes have simply not been good.....including Frost's first.
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So only boosters and the AD are allowed an opinion? :lol:   You wouldn't hold Frost accountable for committing a felony, that's clear.

 
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