The Richie Ingognito situation

[QMany]

I don't get why this is a Nebraska issue. Between Nebraska, Oregon, the Dolphins, and any other NFL team he's played for, I'd argue we are least at fault.

 

[craigsker]

Maybe Ndamakong Suh is no longer the alleged NFL's bad boy?

 

[Minnesota_husker]

Suh is aggressive, a ittle too much, but i dont think he is a prick off the field to the extent that RI is.

Incognito is a horrible human being.. Suh might be a jerk, but i dont think it is to the extent Incongnito is.

 

[GSG]

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

ESPN did, I think for once, a good job interviewing Cris Carter this morning. I don't think we really know the true intent behind Incognito's actions. I think a lot of judgment is unfairly being passed on Richie because of his past, without looking at how he's changed in recent years. Take a look at the CC interview.

This is definitely an interesting controversy, and sides don't have to be taken. The NFL is much different than everyday life. Did Incognito go too far? Maybe. But that doesn't mean we should be quick to rush to Martin's side.

I've said this a few times in other threads, but it is more relevant here than anywhere:

Different people respond differently to different situations. We wouldn't be hearing anything about this had Martin "toughened up." We also wouldn't be hearing anything about this if Richie didn't go too overboard in Martin's opinion.

Basically, I think Richie is being perpetrated as the bully to a much higher degree than he should. This is coming from a 21 year old who didn't care to see Richie play for Nebraska, and I have only read a little bit about his past.

 

[Ulty]

Different people respond differently to different situations. We wouldn't be hearing anything about this had Martin "toughened up." We also wouldn't be hearing anything about this if Richie didn't go too overboard in Martin's opinion.

I don't know how anyone can say that Richie didn't go overboard. Perhaps this sort of behavior is common or acceptable in NFL locker rooms, but it shouldn't be. You're not going to stop a$sholes from being as$holes or people from hazing each other to some extent, but even going by the voicemail, assuming it wasn't a joke and happened more than once (and Richie has an extended history of asshattery), this stuff is totally unacceptable. If it is somewhat common or accepted, that needs to change.

As far as Martin toughening up, it sure looks like the guy has mental health issues. Most people are able to handle some extent of bullying, and we all deal with jerks on a day to day basis everywhere we go, dealing with that is part of life. Richie's bullying (and we certainly don't know the full story) should not be excused, but Martin was not able to handle it the way some others might have. But that is not a matter of being tough, it is a matter of making sure a person is mentally and emotionally healthy. Trying to force a mentally unbalanced person to "toughen up" is sort of like asking a paraplegic to run a little faster.

Every time there is a mass shooting, we as a society briefly have a dialogue about addressing mental health in this country, but it extends to other areas as well, such as NFL locker rooms, the poor and addicted who are in all of our communities. Martin needed more help. Either someone should have seen the signs and found help for him, or he should have done more to make sure his own issues were known and addressed. A therapist should have been provided to help Martin cope. Instead, if the rumors coming out today are true, the Dolphins assigned a raging douchebag in Richie Incognito to address Martin's issues, which is wholly inappropriate and dangerous.

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

Different people respond differently to different situations. We wouldn't be hearing anything about this had Martin "toughened up." We also wouldn't be hearing anything about this if Richie didn't go too overboard in Martin's opinion.

I don't know how anyone can say that Richie didn't go overboard. Perhaps this sort of behavior is common or acceptable in NFL locker rooms, but it shouldn't be. You're not going to stop a$sholes from being as$holes or people from hazing each other to some extent, but even going by the voicemail, assuming it wasn't a joke and happened more than once (and Richie has an extended history of asshattery), this stuff is totally unacceptable. If it is somewhat common or accepted, that needs to change.

As far as Martin toughening up, it sure looks like the guy has mental health issues. Most people are able to handle some extent of bullying, and we all deal with jerks on a day to day basis everywhere we go, dealing with that is part of life. Richie's bullying (and we certainly don't know the full story) should not be excused, but Martin was not able to handle it the way some others might have. But that is not a matter of being tough, it is a matter of making sure a person is mentally and emotionally healthy. Trying to force a mentally unbalanced person to "toughen up" is sort of like asking a paraplegic to run a little faster.

Every time there is a mass shooting, we as a society briefly have a dialogue about addressing mental health in this country, but it extends to other areas as well, such as NFL locker rooms, the poor and addicted who are in all of our communities. Martin needed more help. Either someone should have seen the signs and found help for him, or he should have done more to make sure his own issues were known and addressed. A therapist should have been provided to help Martin cope. Instead, if the rumors coming out today are true, the Dolphins assigned a raging douchebag in Richie Incognito to address Martin's issues, which is wholly inappropriate and dangerous.

I agree. This is a bad situation any way it's dissected. Also, I don't know if you read this or not, but I think Richie may have gone overboard.

 

[The_Big_Dowski]

I can't remember the writers name from the Miami paper (used to work for ESPN), but he made some interesting comments this morning at around 7:45 this morning on Mike and Mike.

When talking about Jonathan Martin, he referred to it as a Stanford/Harvard locker room.

When talking about Incognito, he referred to NFL locker rooms as being "a Nebraska style locker room"

Even though Incognito played at Nebraska, I don't really enjoy being lumped in on the thug side of NFL locker rooms. Just because Suh and Incognito came from Nebraska, that shouldn't quite put us in Miami U status.

 

[NUance]

Martin was expected to play left tackle beside Incognito at guard from the start, so Incognito took him under his wing. They were close friends by all apperances. Martin had a tendency to tank when things would get difficult in practice, and Incognito would lift him up. He’d say, there’s always tomorrow. Richie has been more kind to Martin than any other player.

In other situations, when Martin wasn’t showing effort, Richie would give him a lot of crap. He was a leader on the team, and he would get in your face if you were unprepared or playing poorly. The crap he would give Martin was no more than he gave anyone else, including me. Other players said the same things Incognito said to Martin, so you’d need to suspend the whole team if you suspend Incognito.

LINK

This article that Beanman pointed to in his status update is a must-read. It cuts through the espn bullsh#t and explains what was going on. It's from Lyndon Murtha and appears in Peter King's column on si.com.

 

[beanman]

Martin was expected to play left tackle beside Incognito at guard from the start, so Incognito took him under his wing. They were close friends by all apperances. Martin had a tendency to tank when things would get difficult in practice, and Incognito would lift him up. He’d say, there’s always tomorrow. Richie has been more kind to Martin than any other player.

In other situations, when Martin wasn’t showing effort, Richie would give him a lot of crap. He was a leader on the team, and he would get in your face if you were unprepared or playing poorly. The crap he would give Martin was no more than he gave anyone else, including me. Other players said the same things Incognito said to Martin, so you’d need to suspend the whole team if you suspend Incognito.

LINK

This article that Beanman pointed to in his status update is a must-read. It cuts through the espn bullsh#t and explains what was going on. It's from Lyndon Murtha and appears in Peter King's column on si.com.

This will be written off as a PC campaign by a former friend. Just as all the current players on the Dolphins statements being a PC campaign to protect their own asses.

 

[NUance]

Martin was expected to play left tackle beside Incognito at guard from the start, so Incognito took him under his wing. They were close friends by all apperances. Martin had a tendency to tank when things would get difficult in practice, and Incognito would lift him up. He’d say, there’s always tomorrow. Richie has been more kind to Martin than any other player.

In other situations, when Martin wasn’t showing effort, Richie would give him a lot of crap. He was a leader on the team, and he would get in your face if you were unprepared or playing poorly. The crap he would give Martin was no more than he gave anyone else, including me. Other players said the same things Incognito said to Martin, so you’d need to suspend the whole team if you suspend Incognito.

LINK

This article that Beanman pointed to in his status update is a must-read. It cuts through the espn bullsh#t and explains what was going on. It's from Lyndon Murtha and appears in Peter King's column on si.com.

This will be written off as a PC campaign by a former friend. Just as all the current players on the Dolphins statements being a PC campaign to protect their own asses.

Yeah, you're probably right. But maybe, just maybe, Murtha's article will get the media to ask questions of the other players and coaches. And find out the real story. Hey, it could happen!

 

[beanman]

Martin was expected to play left tackle beside Incognito at guard from the start, so Incognito took him under his wing. They were close friends by all apperances. Martin had a tendency to tank when things would get difficult in practice, and Incognito would lift him up. He’d say, there’s always tomorrow. Richie has been more kind to Martin than any other player.

In other situations, when Martin wasn’t showing effort, Richie would give him a lot of crap. He was a leader on the team, and he would get in your face if you were unprepared or playing poorly. The crap he would give Martin was no more than he gave anyone else, including me. Other players said the same things Incognito said to Martin, so you’d need to suspend the whole team if you suspend Incognito.

LINK

This article that Beanman pointed to in his status update is a must-read. It cuts through the espn bullsh#t and explains what was going on. It's from Lyndon Murtha and appears in Peter King's column on si.com.

This will be written off as a PC campaign by a former friend. Just as all the current players on the Dolphins statements being a PC campaign to protect their own asses.

Yeah, you're probably right. But maybe, just maybe, Murtha's article will get the media to ask questions of the other players and coaches. And find out the real story. Hey, it could happen!

It won't. They want to drag someone through the mud for their stories. I just get annoyed that Nebraska's name gets dragged along with it. I mean, we suspended the guy and he left the team. It's not like we kept allowing him to play.

 

[Ulty]

I can't remember the writers name from the Miami paper (used to work for ESPN), but he made some interesting comments this morning at around 7:45 this morning on Mike and Mike.

When talking about Jonathan Martin, he referred to it as a Stanford/Harvard locker room.

When talking about Incognito, he referred to NFL locker rooms as being "a Nebraska style locker room"

Even though Incognito played at Nebraska, I don't really enjoy being lumped in on the thug side of NFL locker rooms. Just because Suh and Incognito came from Nebraska, that shouldn't quite put us in Miami U status.

I heard that guy on the radio this morning too and thought he sounded like a clown. I'm glad the interview seemed to get cut short. It seemed like this guy was trying to excuse the situation just because Martin and Incognito are both "a different kind of guy" without putting any real thought or analysis into it, and then he calls refers to a thuggish, lowbrow culture as a "Nebraska locker room." GTFO.

 

[T_O_Bull]

Martin was expected to play left tackle beside Incognito at guard from the start, so Incognito took him under his wing. They were close friends by all apperances. Martin had a tendency to tank when things would get difficult in practice, and Incognito would lift him up. He’d say, there’s always tomorrow. Richie has been more kind to Martin than any other player.

In other situations, when Martin wasn’t showing effort, Richie would give him a lot of crap. He was a leader on the team, and he would get in your face if you were unprepared or playing poorly. The crap he would give Martin was no more than he gave anyone else, including me. Other players said the same things Incognito said to Martin, so you’d need to suspend the whole team if you suspend Incognito.

LINK

This article that Beanman pointed to in his status update is a must-read. It cuts through the espn bullsh#t and explains what was going on. It's from Lyndon Murtha and appears in Peter King's column on si.com.

This will be written off as a PC campaign by a former friend. Just as all the current players on the Dolphins statements being a PC campaign to protect their own asses.

Yeah, you're probably right. But maybe, just maybe, Murtha's article will get the media to ask questions of the other players and coaches. And find out the real story. Hey, it could happen!

It won't. They want to drag someone through the mud for their stories. I just get annoyed that Nebraska's name gets dragged along with it. I mean, we suspended the guy and he left the team. It's not like we kept allowing him to play.

Sorry 'beanman' but the more that comes out about Incognito's appalling behavior the more I think he's just a total jerk who hasn't learned how to grow up and be a man, TOTAL JERK! As far as seeing Nebraska's name being dragged through the mud I'm not seeing that at all. Is Incognito's name always prefaced with, 'former Nebraska football player', no its not. You want to get pissed about something how about the fact that every time, and I mean every time, LP's name is mentioned it is, 'former Nebraska running back Laurence Phillips', and that's to this day 18 years later. I find Incognito's actions to be much more reprehensible than LP's. T_O_B

 

[Ulty]

Here is a piece written by a friend of mine who I used to work with conducting workplace investigations, comparing the Incognito/Martin situation to bullying in other workplaces:

http://austinworkpla...d-nfl-bullying/

Bullying is a complete waste of an employer’s payroll and leave budgets but it is, in fact, a norm in many workplace environments. Investigators will need to quantify and compare the culture of bullying to the exchanges between Martin and Incognito. If, for example, it is normal to leave epitaph-laden voicemails for other players, investigators will need to consider whether Mr. Martin was particularly sensitive to the culture or if this is truly a targeted agression. Maybe Mr. Incognito was reasonable to believe that it was acceptable to leave epithath-laden voicemails because it happened so often without consequence throughout the Dolphins and the NFL.