The Village of the "Banned"

I've tried to spend less time in P&R this summer for that very reason. I understand that my points of view differ from others' and that my strident support of the causes I believe in can be abrasive to people, so to cool it down a bit I've posted a bit less. 

 
Enhance said:
The board's nomenclature is a bit different than what we'll tell people. We will tell someone their account is 'suspended' or 'temporarily suspended,' but the board's software will say something like "Banned - 3 days" when you hand out the actual warning. Different phrasing but the result is identical - the account can't access the site.

A permanent ban will say "Banned - indefinitely."

I don't generally like to air someone's laundry unless there's a really good reason or they open the door to it, and since Archy has opened that door, there were two posts included in Archy's warning. One was the one he posted and then this one:

That's flaming. Everyone here knows it's flaming. Everyone here knows it's against the rules. And if someone has shown a repeated inclination to speak to others like this, break board rules, and foster toxic conversation, then more and more severe consequences will follow for that person. Finger pointing and feigning innocence is rarely an excuse.

I had made it abundantly clear in recent months (both literally in multiple threads and via formal warnings) that some of the f#&%ery happening inside of P&R was coming to a head and was going to be met with more serious action if people kept at it. Several people have received warnings and/or temporary suspensions for things they've said or done in P&R so nobody is being unfairly targeted.

I fully understand the subject matter is often times more personal than something like football AND has a tendency to enflame passions in someone any time they see something they disagree with. We have historically been a bit more lenient in that forum because of this. But if the same names keep popping up in different fights, unnecessarily mundane battles of wit, and rule breaking, then eventually something has to be done and I have absolutely zero problem being board parent and putting people in timeout for it.
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Just for the record, Enhance, that is 100% bulls#!t. 

"And this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" 

That's the kind of language used by myself, Knapp, and others on this board with great regularity and zero suspensions. Why? Because it's almost no one's definition of flaming  -- certainly not on most internet political boards and only selectively on this one.

Can you picture someone telling Archy "this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" and being met with only Plus Ones? I sure can. He's actually gotten much worse. From me alone. 

Take the dude to task for his opinions, make him cite his claims, hold his feet to the fire when he moves the goalposts. Keep insulting him, if you think your words aren't technically "flaming." But don't suspend him when he combines a political stance you can''t abide with behavior you allow in others. Jesus. We keep asking Trump voters and conservatives to defend their party, then ban them for getting marginally testy. It's a fucking POLITICS AND RELIGION forum on the internet. Our conservative posters -- at their worst -- are generally more civil and intelligent than the elected GOP representatives we repost and mock. Which may not be saying much, but if these voices aren't around --- and they're almost entirely missing at this point — it's not really a Politics and Religion Forum. It's a private club. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
That's the kind of language used by myself, Knapp, and others on this board with great regularity and zero suspensions. Why? Because it's almost no one's definition of flaming  -- certainly not on most internet political boards and only selectively on this one.
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For someone who is not a moderator/admin and has no frame of reference surrounding what kind of punishments do or do not go out, this is some pretty bold language and posturing.

If memory serves, you have historically been abrasive towards just about any kind of board moderation around here, and you have always been fussed about people getting reprimanded for their behavior but particularly P&R behavior. People that you would probably define as more liberal have had warnings/suspensions as well.

 
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knapplc said:
I've tried to spend less time in P&R this summer for that very reason. I understand that my points of view differ from others' and that my strident support of the causes I believe in can be abrasive to people, so to cool it down a bit I've posted a bit less. 
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Your point of view is actually shared by many on this board. Your passion for your causes is nothing to apologize for. The reason it occasionally comes off as abrasive is how you've chosen to present yourself. That can be fixed by some introspection and tonal adjustments -- same as is being asked of Archy --  except Archy didn't have the choice of  posting less. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Your point of view is actually shared by many on this board. Your passion for your causes is nothing to apologize for. The reason it occasionally comes off as abrasive is how you've chosen to present yourself. That can be fixed by some introspection and tonal adjustments -- same as is being asked of Archy --  except Archy didn't have the choice of  posting less. 
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I have received warnings for things I've posted in P&R. I haven't always agreed with them, but I've understood where they're coming from, and have attempted (not always successfully, I'll admit) to modify my approach. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Just for the record, Enhance, that is 100% bulls#!t. 

"And this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" 

That's the kind of language used by myself, Knapp, and others on this board with great regularity and zero suspensions. Why? Because it's almost no one's definition of flaming  -- certainly not on most internet political boards and only selectively on this one.

Can you picture someone telling Archy "this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" and being met with only Plus Ones? I sure can. He's actually gotten much worse. From me alone. 

Take the dude to task for his opinions, make him cite his claims, hold his feet to the fire when he moves the goalposts. Keep insulting him, if you think your words aren't technically "flaming." But don't suspend him when he combines a political stance you can''t abide with behavior you allow in others. Jesus. We keep asking Trump voters and conservatives to defend their party, then ban them for getting marginally testy. It's a fucking POLITICS AND RELIGION forum on the internet. Our conservative posters -- at their worst -- are generally more civil and intelligent than the elected GOP representatives we repost and mock. Which may not be saying much, but if these voices aren't around --- and they're almost entirely missing at this point — it's not really a Politics and Religion Forum. It's a private club. 
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I do wonder if this poster got a month ban for posting this post, which got three plus ones and a trophy?   A phrase that looks pretty familiar.  
A reasonable person could assume it’s a phrase that one could use without getting banned for a month since others have used it without consequence. 

“This is why no one takes you seriously”

 
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Guy Chamberlin said:
Just for the record, Enhance, that is 100% bulls#!t. 

"And this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" 

That's the kind of language used by myself, Knapp, and others on this board with great regularity and zero suspensions. Why? Because it's almost no one's definition of flaming  -- certainly not on most internet political boards and only selectively on this one.

Can you picture someone telling Archy "this is why no one takes you seriously, and for good reason" and being met with only Plus Ones? I sure can. He's actually gotten much worse. From me alone. 

Take the dude to task for his opinions, make him cite his claims, hold his feet to the fire when he moves the goalposts. Keep insulting him, if you think your words aren't technically "flaming." But don't suspend him when he combines a political stance you can''t abide with behavior you allow in others. Jesus. We keep asking Trump voters and conservatives to defend their party, then ban them for getting marginally testy. It's a fucking POLITICS AND RELIGION forum on the internet. Our conservative posters -- at their worst -- are generally more civil and intelligent than the elected GOP representatives we repost and mock. Which may not be saying much, but if these voices aren't around --- and they're almost entirely missing at this point — it's not really a Politics and Religion Forum. It's a private club. 
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This lamenting the lack of vocal Trump and MAGA supporters in P&R has reached a concerning level. We both know there is no rational explanation these people could offer and moreover, most of them realize it so they keep their mouth shut. The ones that attempt to explain it and rationalize are justly met with tons of pushback, facts and reality.

Yes, it would be awesome if they were well represented in that forum and their opinions and points of view were defensible but alas they are not. I’ve received warnings and suspensions due to my actions from both sides. I used to be one of the more vocal conservative right POVs on this board and never once were any moderator actions against me due to my political leanings. Even the times  I disagreed with the warning or suspension, which was most of the times, it was always attributable to how I presented it and board rules and never because of what side of the spectrum it represented. Hell, I got a 1 week suspension for telling someone they were being dense…..when they were obviously being purposely dense. Others were permabanned simply for using the phrase “butt hurt”.

Personally I’m a bit fed up with all the histrionics over this. Moderators are human. Interpretation of the rules will have some variability. Accept it and get over it. If you have a deep desire to hear from MAGA, travel to a sparsely populated state and pull up a stool at a local coop or coffee shop. The well spoken, intelligent, fact checked Trump supporter doesn’t exist.

 
JJ Husker said:
Personally I’m a bit fed up with all the histrionics over this. Moderators are human. Interpretation of the rules will have some variability. Accept it and get over it. If you have a deep desire to hear from MAGA, travel to a sparsely populated state and pull up a stool at a local coop or coffee shop. The well spoken, intelligent, fact checked Trump supporter doesn’t exist.
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:yeah

Ya know, on this board we ALL put a valiant effort into being snarky but not too snarky. Some are wittier and cleverer than others, some get bent out of shape too quickly, some show more restraint. Archy is one of the best at being snarky, argumentative, and obtuse when it suits his interests but not crossing the line into rules violations, although we don't know how many times he has received warnings, or how many times others have gotten warnings.

I am guessing that most of us would agree that the post that got him suspended was not super egregious on its own, but combine it with what I assume were recent warnings, his impressively prolific track record of similar comments, and the fact that he has been an unabashed bulls#!t artist since the day he joined this board, it is safe to say that Archy is certainly no victim here. He pushed the envelope as we all do, but one day it went to far and shots were fired. The fact that he has returned and he has not taken any responsibility for his own actions (and his posts in this thread are rather snowflakey indeed) is 100% predictable, and honestly boring.

I respect Guy's opinion and his quest for balanced discussion, but this was certainly no miscarriage of justice. This is a very fairly moderated board. We have the Woodshed to fall back on, the forums generally do not turn into the wild west, and a lot of us are pretty smart and civil for the most part, including the mods. But Archy was not suspended for his radical fascist conservative viewpoints, it was for his behavior. There are many more deserving outlets for your sympathy other than here.  

 
^ agreed

Enhance sharing the other post kind of obfuscates it a little, I think. My guess is Archy's suspension is due much more to his impressive body of work across months than it is due to those two posts, which are in the vein of similar posts other people make from time to time. But those others who might post something similar don't have nearly the rich history of bulls#!t, snark and conversation torpedo-ing.

I also would love more engagement across political ideologies, but the reality is that there's a massive asymmetrical imbalance when it comes to posters and being able to even attempt to have informed, good-faith arguments. 

 
This is refreshing! It's been awhile since we've had the old suspended/banned discussion.

Maybe the football team will be above .500 this season!!!

 
Enhance said:
If memory serves, you have historically been abrasive towards just about any kind of board moderation around here, and you have always been fussed about people getting reprimanded for their behavior but particularly P&R behavior. People that you would probably define as more liberal have had warnings/suspensions as well.
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Yep. 

 
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