The P&R Plague Thread (Covid-19)

[Dr. Strangelove]

It’s not a world view, it’s actually just a view about a virus origin.  But nice hyperbolic deflection. 
 

Nope.   It’s a sentiment and not proven true.  Again nice hyperbolic deflection 

I'm not deflecting anything. I'm simply pointing out the absurd nature of modern conservatism and the lengths individuals go through to make their conservative identity work.

I fully support research and further investigations into the origins of COVID-19. It is still most likely occurred naturally, but it's possible (although improbable) that it originated in a lab.

What I find amusing is that Conservatives like you latch onto the DOE report as if it's gospel - because you WANT it to be true. Conservatives have to reject reality to make their conservative identity make sense. So the nanosecond an institution publishes something that confirms any portion of that identity, its latched onto - despite what any number of other reports or studies say about the matter.

Furthermore, scientific findings and near total agreement among scientists about climate change is rejected because it runs counter to your conservative identity. The same can be said about scientific findings about COVID death rates in counties that voted for Trump, efficacy of vaccines or Ivermectin or any number of things. This is not treated with the same vigor because it runs counter to the Conservative identity - and it would really suck if conservative voting led to all these terrible outcomes and therefore must be false. 

 

[commando]

No comment?

i am old enough to remember when the FBI was part of the deep state and not to be trusted.

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

Were the Chinese studying the emergence of a coronavirus variation? 

I mean, there was already a family of existing coronaviruses that everyone was studying. The rage-frothing question is whether COVID-19 was hatched in lab, or was it being contained and studied in a lab. 

Before Teach gets his penis in a bunch, I'm not being a China apologist. I'm not going to trust what the Chinese government tells us regardless, although I do think the brotherhood of international epidemiolgists will eventually ferret out some truth on its own.

And let's face it, if you want to get frothy and xenophobic, you can still rage at China for its unregulated and barbaric wet markets. Win/win!

One interesting take for the Lauren Boberts to ignore is the fact that the Obama administration had a team of American epidemiologists on the ground in China for this very reason: China was a likely place for a pandemic emergence and the Chinese government could not be trusted with their public pronouncements. Donald Trump dismantled the pandemic team because, you know, Obama. 

 

[Archy1221]

What I find amusing is that Conservatives like you latch onto the DOE report as if it's gospel - because you WANT it to be true. Conservatives have to reject reality to make their conservative identity make sense. So the nanosecond an institution publishes something that confirms any portion of that identity, its latched onto - despite what any number of other reports or studies say about the matter.

This ladies and gentlemen is a great example of the Art of Projection.  It’s very well done.   A tweet about DOE report was shared without comment by me.   Though I do agree with the person who made the tweet in saying this discussion had been suppressed and tried to be shut down by “the experts”.   Same thing is still happening on here as shown above.   Poster tries to ridicule, use hyperbolic language, and “rage farm” about latching on to a study that shares my point of view on the subject all the while trying to claim I’m anti-science. 
 

Unlike you, I’m open to being wrong, when evidence is presented to confirm natural origin. Like finding the species in the wild that has Covid-19.   I’m hoping you are aware how small the odds that a coronavirus mutated into Covid -19 virus inside the body of an animal while an animal was sitting in a cage in Wuhan that against almost all odds was able to jump to humans in a capacity to latch and create spread on its first jump attempt.  
 

We do know however, that it is much easier for human to animal transmission.  Why didn’t the paper from 2022 look into the possibility that humans infected those caged animals that they claim were responsible for a zoonotic jump?  The likely hood of that is much greater occurring to the CDC. 

 

[Archy1221]

i am old enough to remember when the FBI was part of the deep state and not to be trusted.

I’m old enough to remember when we were supposed to believe the FBI without question :dunno

 

[teachercd]

If it matters what I think, my money is on a leak from the Wuhan Lab. I think it’s overly coincidental that the first cases were near Wuhan and that lab happens to “study” the Coronavirus. Toss in an unhealthy dose of coverup and obfuscation by China and well….

The only thing I’m not completely convinced of is if that lab was trying to weaponize the virus and if the “leak” was intentional or accidental. I’m all but ruling out natural occurrence.

But even I realize that is speculation if and until we are able to get more information or access which may never come. None of our agencies reports prove anything and do not illicit a high level of confidence.

Yep!

the fact hat some people can't admit that it so clearly came from that lab is just weird.  

 

[teachercd]

Were the Chinese studying the emergence of a coronavirus variation? 

I mean, there was already a family of existing coronaviruses that everyone was studying. The rage-frothing question is whether COVID-19 was hatched in lab, or was it being contained and studied in a lab. 

Before Teach gets his penis in a bunch, I'm not being a China apologist. I'm not going to trust what the Chinese government tells us regardless, although I do think the brotherhood of international epidemiolgists will eventually ferret out some truth on its own.

And let's face it, if you want to get frothy and xenophobic, you can still rage at China for its unregulated and barbaric wet markets. Win/win!

One interesting take for the Lauren Boberts to ignore is the fact that the Obama administration had a team of American epidemiologists on the ground in China for this very reason: China was a likely place for a pandemic emergence and the Chinese government could not be trusted with their public pronouncements. Donald Trump dismantled the pandemic team because, you know, Obama. 

Dude...If you have to say it...you probably are!

Also, thanks for thinking what I have between my legs is a penis.  

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

Yep!

the fact hat some people can't admit that it so clearly came from that lab is just weird.  

Well in fact the very DOE report in question rated its own confidence in that conclusion as Low Confidence, and the other "some people" are fellow intelligence agencies, so not exactly clear or weird,. Just one of the possibilities, Mr. Quasi Penis. 

 

[Archy1221]

Yep!

the fact hat some people can't admit that it so clearly came from that lab is just weird.  

Oh no.   Now you two have done it

Soon you are gonna have someone saying you don’t understand science and you don’t understand what you are saying.   Next your gonna have someone say your conservative and immediately latch onto anything to support your views.  And a few more will accuse you of raging.  Good luck and God Speed.  

 

[JJ Husker]

I’m pretty sure the safe fall back position on China is to not trust anything they say and to assume the worst. They have not shown to be trustworthy or mindful of ethics. I would call that simply being realistic and not necessarily xenophobic.

 

[teachercd]

Oh no.   Now you two have done it

Soon you are gonna have someone saying you don’t understand science and you don’t understand what you are saying.   Next your gonna have someone say your conservative and immediately latch onto anything to support your views.  And a few more will accuse you of raging.  Good luck and God Speed.  

I know!

Look, I am just a normal everyday person.  But if you think it wasn't made in a lab, well, you are lying to yourself because you probably were so against the idea that it was from a lab.

 

[teachercd]

I’m pretty sure the safe fall back position on China is to not trust anything they say and to assume the worst. They have not shown to be trustworthy or mindful of ethics. I would call that simply being realistic and not necessarily xenophobic.

What?  XENOPHOBE!  I WOULD NEVER BUY (the stuff you make, I don't get your work at all so I don't know) FROM YOU!

With that said, China clearly lies about everything, we all knew that.  With that said, I still buy s#!t made in China all the time.  #IAMAWHORE

 

[teachercd]

Well in fact the very DOE report in question rated its own confidence in that conclusion as Low Confidence, and the other "some people" are fellow intelligence agencies, so not exactly clear or weird,. Just one of the possibilities, Mr. Quasi Penis. 

I don't think China is moderating this site.  This isn't TikTok.

 

[Scarlet]

So a guy working at the Wuhan Institute of Virology got on his Honda Wave not once but twice in a matter of weeks and drove directly from work to the Wuhan wet market over 10 miles away.  Each time he did so with a different variant...variants for which a linked variant has never been identified in humans.  He went directly to the racoon dogs and red foxes, which just so happen to be susceptible to coronaviruses, being kept in cages because he had a hankering for some forest meat and infected them without first infecting anyone else along the way or in the course of his daily comings and goings.. 

He then infected the animals with a coronavirus which incidently have  jumped from animals to humans a number of times recently for example with the common cold, MERS and SARS.   In doing so he was the unwitting source of the global pandemic.  Turns out he is the one that lead to the epicenter of cases being the wet market.  He didn't infect anyone at the lab, his home, the pub down the street, or the market near his work.  Who knew racoon dog was so delish that it's worth battling Wuhan traffic on 100cc motorscooter?  

Not saying that didn't happen but yeah it's definitely weird to believe that animals at the wet market were the hosts, I mean since most of the evidence points that way.   Scientists are weird. 

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

You guys do know there's a long history of pandemics caused by viruses jumping species. It's kinda been the pandemic MO for the last several years, if not most of the Life on Earth era. 

So why would it be weird to believe this time? 

I was against the idea it was from a lab when there was no clear evidence of any kind, the President was calling it The China Virus, and people were beating up Japanese Americans for looking Chinese. 

At the same time, is China capable of running a flawed and dangerous virology lab? Or conducting viral warfare against the West? Sure. Why not?  But pretending the evidence is conclusive is also a bit weird, as is rooting for the latter scenario as if it's preferable.