Danny Bateman
Donor
I don't understand what's confusing about my previous post. If you want me to clarify I'd be happy to.
How far Left, could a Leftist Left, if a Leftist could Left, Left.
- Thread starter B.B. Hemingway
- Start date
funhusker
Active member
My apologies if this was meant for me. I was referring to B.B.'s post from above...
Mierin
Donor
You're missing the point that the incarcerations are at a higher rate for the same crimes, and for longer times (19.1% longer) for the same crimes. All of the criminals should be arrested, but if Black criminals are arrested at higher rates, it's going to have a negative effect on the different outcomes that are being talked about in this thread, e.g. poverty, single parenthood, etc. If arrest rates were equal for the same crime, Blacks might not be lagging behind by as much in those areas. When it comes to drug use and possession, the rates are similar for Whites and Blacks. But Blacks are arrested at higher rates despite the same rate of crime, so their drug use and possession actually has much more of an effect on the outcomes we're talking about. If you consider drug use to be a cultural problem, both cultures have it, but if we include opioid abuse, Whites use drugs at a significantly higher rate than Blacks.
And I was going to look at violent crime statistics, but the shutdown has caused bjs.gov to not work, so all I can see is this part from the google link description: "Poor urban blacks (51.3 per 1,000) had rates of violence similar to poor urban whites (56.4 per 1,000)."
Here's the chart on jail time:
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Danny Bateman
Donor
@Moiraine
You brought up an important corollary in this discussion: the opioid epidemic.
One of the more insightful revelations I have happened upon is the language (and approach) we've used towards drug crimes as a society.
Remember when we had the crack epidemic in the 80s? The end result by our government was the War on Drugs, a crime bill to harshly penalize drug crimes and massive, disproportionate, lasting negative impact on African Americans in the U.S.
Now we're essentially going through the same thing with opioid use/abuse, which is a predominantly white problem. But now it's talked about in terms of a public health crisis and our approach stresses the importance of the need for treatment and rehabilitation of those affected instead of punishment.
How much of that is us learning from the err of our ways from the crack epidemic, and how much of it is because it is a white rather than a black problem?
You brought up an important corollary in this discussion: the opioid epidemic.
One of the more insightful revelations I have happened upon is the language (and approach) we've used towards drug crimes as a society.
Remember when we had the crack epidemic in the 80s? The end result by our government was the War on Drugs, a crime bill to harshly penalize drug crimes and massive, disproportionate, lasting negative impact on African Americans in the U.S.
Now we're essentially going through the same thing with opioid use/abuse, which is a predominantly white problem. But now it's talked about in terms of a public health crisis and our approach stresses the importance of the need for treatment and rehabilitation of those affected instead of punishment.
How much of that is us learning from the err of our ways from the crack epidemic, and how much of it is because it is a white rather than a black problem?
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ZRod
Active member
This is the point I'm trying to get at. When two teams start out on the 20, but one gets a personal foul for 15 yards and the other half the distance to the goal for the same personal foul, you'd be mad at the players but screaming at the refs wouldn't you, @B.B. Hemingway?You're missing the point that the incarcerations are at a higher rate for the same crimes, and for longer times (19.1% longer) for the same crimes. All of the criminals should be arrested, but if Black criminals are arrested at higher rates, it's going to have a negative effect on the different outcomes that are being talked about in this thread, e.g. poverty, single parenthood, etc. If arrest rates were equal for the same crime, Blacks might not be lagging behind by as much in those areas. When it comes to drug use and possession, the rates are similar for Whites and Blacks. But Blacks are arrested at higher rates despite the same rate of crime, so their drug use and possession actually has much more of an effect on the outcomes we're talking about. If you consider drug use to be a cultural problem, both cultures have it, but if we include opioid abuse, Whites use drugs at a significantly higher rate than Blacks.
And I was going to look at violent crime statistics, but the shutdown has caused bjs.gov to not work, so all I can see is this part from the google link description: "Poor urban blacks (51.3 per 1,000) had rates of violence similar to poor urban whites (56.4 per 1,000)."
Here's the chart on jail time:
VectorVictor
Donor
You probably need to spell out if the 15-yard penalty recipient is black, as that will likely color his reply.
Take that as you will.
Landlord
Banned
Well putting an officiating bias and conspiracy aside, the players should have just played mistake free football they've got nobody to blame but themselves.
VectorVictor
Donor
Except that you can't put bias aside, as you have humans making these calls, and sometimes they make mistakes as well...especially if the players are a certain color, as the evidence already presented in this thread points out.
ZRod
Active member
VectorVictor
Donor
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Guy Chamberlin
Active member
Just want to step in and defend Last Week Tonight with John Oliver. This got on the air in the guise of a humor show, but they regularly do 15 - 20 minute segments on complicated issues like Brexit, predatory lending, and our historic relationship with Saudi Arabia, with a very high degree of investigative reporting, fact checking and meaningful context. The jokes are broad, profane and left-leaning, but the reporting is solid, verifiable, and useful.
The Daily Show has always gone for the quick joke, but it also has a prolific research staff, and sometimes it's greatest function is pulling up clips of politicians directly contradicting themselves and/or getting caught in a direct lie. Don't see that practiced on the actual news networks. Not sure why.
The Daily Show has always gone for the quick joke, but it also has a prolific research staff, and sometimes it's greatest function is pulling up clips of politicians directly contradicting themselves and/or getting caught in a direct lie. Don't see that practiced on the actual news networks. Not sure why.
Danny Bateman
Donor
Really don't see either of those on mainstream news as much as we should.
If we saw more deep dive investigative work and reporting on complex issues in our society like healthcare, immigration, the Second Amendment & gun control or criminal justice reform, we'd all be a lot more informed and probably better able to craft bipartisan legislation everyone can like at least a part of.
As is, most news outlets are way to concerned with "BREAKING NEWS" and fall into the trap of trying to report on every silly thing POTUS says or does. It completely nerfs the ability for most of the electorate to digest these issues like they should. They're also more than happy to toss out a few lefties and a few righties and let them argue things out on air for cheap ratings while leaving all of us in our little enclaves and reinforcing our own biases.
ZRod
Active member
B.B. Hemingway
Donor
Woke af....
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